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I'm with you Mican. We've argued about both the is and ought but Bel kind of dances back and forth between the two concepts freely and thus so do my responses.

It may be partly because I...

I respect your approach, but, I've found that there are times when speaking the language spoken to you can achieve something that being polite cant.
1. You can show some cultural affinity
2. You...

Under what circumstances would it be moral for a woman to kill a man to prevent being raped?



What is the distinction here? If it is just some specific circumstance, what are the...

Absolutely. It is a well-established fact.



You could tell me to stand up without using my legs but it would be a foolish request. The supreme court is the final arbiter of what the...

OK, Two questions...
1. I got the impression life was a greater moral value than liberty in your view. If so, why is it ok to kill someone to preserve yourself from rape?

2. What is a...

Criminal law generally is a moral judgment, at least in most societies. I think I mentioned in the other thread it is good to make legal/moral distinctions sometimes. So...
Legally: Murder is an...

Nowhere. Nor does it speak to the rights of dogs or cats, nor to computers or turnbuckles. Nor does it delineate the rights of humans.

The language used in the bill of rights is "people" or...

Is this your position? It's not mine. I'm simply arguing that the fact is, emotions have causes and are not random, contrary to your claim that they can change for no reason.



Sorry, these...

Here is my take on Progressives using somewhat absolutist terms.

Progressives think that you can always do better, and you achieve that through coordinated action and cooperation. If you see a...

Well, this thread isn't about abortion, its about the nature of morality. I am using abortion as an example to illustrate an idea. The idea is that when you look at morality critically, you find that...

I was wondering how the heck I got into this conversation! :P

Just a quoting thing I see. But ya I agree, God totally subverted free will. Furthermore, he did it so he could show how mighty...

No. Look, one problem I have with debating you is you are often rather imprecise with your language. Small differences can convey a lot of meaning.

Emotion is a basis for a decision to kill...

I think that is a pretty good breakdown.

I disagree a little in that I think PC is largely a left phenomenon. The right has some similar tropes but nothing quite the same.

I don't think the...

You are looking to show contradictions in the law. But, you are dealing with state laws (which are different in nearly every state) and federal law which overrides state law when the two are in...

Side Notes



It's a good thing I didn't ask that question then.



I think you misunderstand. The basis of something is not to say that it is the only thing it is composed of. It is to say...

A cis-girl is just a girl and there is nothing wrong with that.



It really is.



How many trans people can you count among your friends and associates? If the answer is more than zero,...

Yes, it was mentioned in the majority decision. Texas claimed they were legal persons, the supreme court rejected this claim. Find a copy of it and do a text search to find the exact quotation and...

Main Discussion



This is a lot better. I can understand it and it is a direct statement that addresses the question at least a little. Thanks!

OK, so you think morality is subjective. Great,...

Neither. It comes from the fact that the fetus is not a legal person. That doesn't mean they are not human. A corporation is a legal person, its not a human being.



You are both legal...

Side Notes/discussion



Honestly, I don't know why you think I have a "Knot in my panties" or even what you mean by that.

Main Discussion
I did answer directly in post #4 (my first post...

Always.



That is usually my #1 goal in a discussion.



A Trans-boy was born as a girl but decided to live as a boy. If they want to live as a boy, I'm happy to treat them as a boy, but...

Yes, it's at least partly in the Roe v Wade decision. Unborn children are not legal persons under the eyes of the constitution.

That doesn't mean the government can't have an interest in...

Side Notes/discussion



I think subjective is a more accurate description.

Consider something like fear of foreigners. It is not arbitrary, it applies to people with some defined traits. It...

Sounds good. Ya I think what we may need to do is kind of re-draw the lines of argument here. Summarize what you think are the relevant points on any given side.

There are perhaps three areas at...

We can come back to that later.



No, that's not my intent, at least not directly. I just presume that if you think morality based on feelings is arbitrary, then you have some other standard for...

Cool, Thanks Squatch. You can nuke the other one I made. I thought you'd deleted this one.

Who said it was needless? People always have needs.



Body autonomy is the right to choose what to do with your body. The right to life is not the same thing.



No, it contains my DNA, it...

A fish doesn't fit well into the net when they flip around, struggle and make a fuss. They fit just fine when they accept it. :)

Which is to say, it's not confusing if you bother to try and...

Background

Belthazar and I were discussing abortion. I gave a list of criteria by which many people make a moral evaluation about abortion. Belthazar found these evaluations to be arbitrary and...

Yes. And we weigh that moral value against the mother's right to bodily autonomy and self-determination.



You could say the sun is only up or not. But in truth, it is more complicated than...