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  1. Re: Increasing the Minimum Wage hurts those most vulnerable in our society.

    Well to continue the analogy, it would be like like me insisting that my goals count for 5 and yours count for 2 and you agreeing to that scoring metric. Then the ref saying "no, you aren't allowed...
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    Re: 75 Ways Socialism Has Improved America

    Fair enough, just a bit of playful fun.


    No, they aren't.

    Its this poor understanding of language which has caused all the uproar over the Citizens United case. Corporations are persons...
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    Re: "Rigged" election?

    Any insight into why multiple supreme courts have disagreed with you? I mean we've had additional questions on every single census since we wrote the Constitution, right? So how has no one felt...
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    Re: "Rigged" election?

    So is it your contention that every census since the first one in 1790 has been unconstitutional then? They all asked additional questions after all (and most, if not all, had a citizenship or...
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    Re: 75 Ways Socialism Has Improved America

    http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q112/jzorns/Trash%20Talking/threadnecromancyns1nf0.jpg



    Hmm, that is a pretty broad definition I think. I could fit Amazon into that definition since their...
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    Re: "Rigged" election?

    Two questions then. We know that almost any additional question would lower response rate (that is pretty common in public polling, longer poll questions don't get many respondents), so does that...
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    Re: "Rigged" election?

    But this census is still going out to everyone right? They aren't proposing that it won't go to non-citizens or that non-citizens won't be counted in assigning representation. So I'm not sure why...
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    Re: "Rigged" election?

    Fantastic. Now, can you tie that language to your argument that the current census violates that text?
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    Re: "Rigged" election?

    It would be. But you never directly cited the Constitution, you just incidentally referenced it. It would seem reasonable for you to post the specific clause you mean and detail why you think this...
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    Re: "Rigged" election?

    Unless you are using a definition of that term (primary documents) that I'm unaware of, I'd have to push back on this. Where, specifically did you refer to a primary document?
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    Re: "Rigged" election?

    Let's keep the conversation civil please and focus on debating the subject, not the person.



    In an attempt to move the discussion along before this degenerates further, I'll note two things. ...
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    Re: The Mueller Report

    Just wanted to add a slight clarification. Cowboy opened this thread in the Clubhouse, so the usual support rules don't apply.
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    Re: Theistic beliefs are not rationally justified

    Well then I’m glad we went down the rabbit hole a bit because we’ve been able to clarify the disagreement a bit. We can set the whole concept of evolution aside a bit here and discuss more your...
  14. Re: Increasing the Minimum Wage hurts those most vulnerable in our society.

    This would seem to concede that the one blocking the person from getting a job is the government.

    I also have to obtain a permit to speak in a public park in most places. Does that mean that...
  15. Re: Increasing the Minimum Wage hurts those most vulnerable in our society.

    This doesn't seem to represent the analogy. I have agreed to participate. I have agreed to pay Ibelsd X dollars. He has agreed to perform services. The only non-agreement on this deal is the...
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    Re: Theistic beliefs are not rationally justified

    I moved this section to the top because I think it supersedes the next two quotes (feel free to ignore them since I think you are correct that they are moot in this conversation). You are correct...
  17. Re: Increasing the Minimum Wage hurts those most vulnerable in our society.

    I'm not sure where you got that idea. I'm saying that Ibelsd and I have an agreement for him to do a certain job for a rate we both agree on. The only reason that deal isn't made is that someone...
  18. Re: Increasing the Minimum Wage hurts those most vulnerable in our society.

    Well the effect is what is important here. It isn't the motivations that matter much when we are looking at inner-city poverty rates, its the actual cause of those poverty rates.

    And I'm not sure...
  19. Re: Increasing the Minimum Wage hurts those most vulnerable in our society.

    Ibelsd's response is correct. Intent isn't relevant because the comparison is about effect, not intent. Both policies have the same effect because they rely on the same mechanism, a barrier to...
  20. Re: Increasing the Minimum Wage hurts those most vulnerable in our society.

    No need of course. At this point I've been talking to him for something like 550 posts, that has to bear some insight into his position I would hope. Nor would I expect you to have waded through...
  21. Re: Increasing the Minimum Wage hurts those most vulnerable in our society.

    I'm not sure this is quite representative of the thread. The opening post was a practice run for an argument I use in my circle of more progressive friends quite a bit, and do so quite successfully....
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    Re: Theistic beliefs are not rationally justified

    1 however doesnít really make sense from a process point of view. The asteroid is external to any biological process involved with evolution that Iíve heard of. Letís use an example. Beavers have...
  23. Re: Increasing the Minimum Wage hurts those most vulnerable in our society.

    Great point. It is somewhat akin to Thomas Sowell's "There are no solutions in life, only tradeoffs" or Friedman's "There is no such thing as a free lunch." I think that that has been the tack I've...
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    Re: Theistic beliefs are not rationally justified

    Ahh, I think I see the miscommunication. The topic was related to whether a hypothetical alien would be more or less objective related to analyzing evolution. That alien was analyzing the process,...
  25. Re: Increasing the Minimum Wage hurts those most vulnerable in our society.

    First, Sharmak you didnít answer the primary question from the top of my post:

    So because this is a policy that hurts real people, let's see what we are talking about on the personal level. What...
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    Re: Where are the Russia Collusion Charges?

    Which you've already posted and which I already pointed out does not support your claim. Putin's interest and desire, even his active involvement in the campaign does not lend support to the...
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    Re: Where are the Russia Collusion Charges?

    Yes, and you'll notice I didn't rule that you needed to support that you have knowledge of possible futures. I ruled that you didn't support the claim you made, which is still the case. Thus making...
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    Re: Where are the Russia Collusion Charges?

    You were challenged to support this statement: "Well, she wouldn't have sucked as president." You offered no support for that claim. Your attempt to reframe it as an "alternate past" does nothing...
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    Re: Where are the Russia Collusion Charges?

    Since Cowboy declined to offer support for his claim that Clinton "wouldn't have sucked as a president" we can consider that claim retracted. Please do not make it again without support.
    ...
  30. Re: Increasing the Minimum Wage hurts those most vulnerable in our society.

    I moved this part of the response up to the top because it does seem to be the bottom line of what we are discussing. The question is, do we make policy decisions based on experts in a field and...
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