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    Re: Objective morality vs. subjective morality

    Ok, I give. I will endeavor to sharpen my communication skills, but in another thread, cause I just ain't getting thru in this one.

    Whatever the current state of morals in our universe may be,...
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    Re: Objective morality vs. subjective morality

    And you are ok till "the system that exists is superior" ......at this point your argument fails.

    A correct "belief" has absolutely no affect on the superiority of the system, only its correct...
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    Re: Objective morality vs. subjective morality

    It MOST certainly does not.

    It shows the persons beliefs are correct about the moral system in his universe, nothing else.

    How does that possibly make that moral system itself superior?
    And...
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    Re: Objective morality vs. subjective morality

    And this is where you keep leaving the reservation....

    Just because a persons beliefs are in line with the moral reality of that universe does not in any way make THAT moral system superior. It...
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    Re: Who are we to question the gods?

    That you do not notice, hardly attests to its truth value.


    *http://www.utaot.com/tag/dna/


    (Sorry, I am learning to add links, I need a secretary :)
    When I was in high school, 4 resistors...
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    Re: Objective morality vs. subjective morality

    Cool Beans!! So we are on the same page here, finally :)

    (How could anyone translate old languages that don't exist anymore with any accuracy when it take so many posts to grasp this (any) idea?...
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    Re: Who are we to question the gods?

    This appears to be incorrect. Things that happened to your great grandparents affect "your" personality. So called "junk" DNA, may not be so junk after all (why would it be there if there were no...
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    Re: Objective morality vs. subjective morality

    So if a person's "belief of the current state of morals in this universes accurately described it, that person's belief's are superior to someone that didn't have an accurate assessment".

    Is this...
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    Re: Who are we to question the gods?

    You two talk about evolution as if it were a "thinking thing". Evolution doesn't "select" anything. It's merely a theory that describes how populations of organisms change over time. An individual...
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    Re: Who are we to question the gods?

    I think I was too focused on your rabbit example, I think I may see your point now.

    So at the synapse level in the brain, reactions are taking place, back and forth from electrical to chemical,...
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    Re: Objective morality vs. subjective morality

    Of course that is not what you are "arguing". What I am saying is what your argument naturally leads us to...

    And you are defining "correct" as whatever the "current state of this universe is at...
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    Re: Who are we to question the gods?

    Ok, but a whole human population is different than one rabbit. Human's remember. And learn from each other. Trial and error. That is how logic would come to pass. You see some one fishing. They catch...
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    Re: Slavery and the bible as a moral guide

    [/COLOR]

    How can a slave's life possibly not be "inferior" to that of a free man if he is "property"?
    Or do you just mean, God thinks no less of a slave than he does an owner? As in their lives...
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    Re: Objective morality vs. subjective morality

    Hmmmm, well if I can only discuss "this universe, at this time, and no other possibilities", then ok, it's "superior" only because it is currently true.
    (I only "invoked things" so we would have...
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    Re: Who are we to question the gods?

    Apok once defined "logic" as "ordered thinking". If that is the case, why is God necessary for human's to be able to think in "ordered" way. As logic really isn't a thing, but more of a regulated,...
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    Re: Who are we to question the gods?

    I don't know too much about the Hebrew Bible, but willing to learn. I would love to hear/see the proof you speak of :)

    I'm curious though, if God does provide proof that he exists AND cares how we...
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    Re: Objective morality vs. subjective morality

    I like your attitude!

    ---------- Post added at 06:32 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:27 PM ----------



    If they are living "better", do they really need to "justify" it?
    Who do they...
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    Re: Slavery and the bible as a moral guide

    Good day Rabbi :)

    ---------- Post added at 05:23 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:21 PM ----------



    I believe most people would see this as self evident.

    May I ask, would you be ok...
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    Re: Objective morality vs. subjective morality

    So only this moment, only this universe, whatever the actual current state of morals is correct/superior.....whatever....

    You also said if this universe is subjective then that would be the...
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    Re: Slavery and the bible as a moral guide

    Is the Bible forwarded by Christianity as the true word of God?
    Where in the Bible does it say that you need to read other sources to understand it?
    (Why should you need other sources to understand...
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    Re: Objective morality vs. subjective morality

    I must not be relating my thoughts clearly enough. I will try to be more concise.

    I am good with discussing JUST the universe we live in.
    However, we don't know if this universe is Obj moral or...
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    Re: Objective morality vs. subjective morality

    Which is what I was talking about as well. Since we don't know what moral universe we live in , could be any, right?

    ---------- Post added at 07:01 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:54 PM...
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    Re: Slavery and the bible as a moral guide

    Hmmmm (to your first point).

    But to the second, is "helping a murderer an immoral act" is vague enough to go either way. Help him murder, immoral, helping him get a meal if he hasn't eaten,...
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    Re: Slavery and the bible as a moral guide

    Actually we are not discussing that. We are using the Bible itself as a "moral guide", not how it was subjectively used.

    Let's try a different take that doesn't take an hour to read and five hours...
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    Re: Objective morality vs. subjective morality

    I appreciate your sincere openness.
    As I probe, challenge, and discuss what you are forwarding as "truth", please do not take offense at anything I might say or ask. Sometimes I exchange expediency...
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    Re: Slavery and the bible as a moral guide

    (I just don't have time to respond to your whole post, so please take my short posts when I can)

    That "laws and courts were established" using the Bible is fine, but this Op is "the Bible". Not...
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    Re: Objective morality vs. subjective morality

    Being "correct" in this sense only means you have actually identified whether you live in an objective or subjective (or both) moral universe. This still doesn't speak to how this would necessarily...
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    Re: Objective morality vs. subjective morality

    It most certainly does not. You say it over and over, but until you say why, it holds the same weight as the first time you said it.

    Why does it "stand" other than you say so?

    If our current...
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    Re: Slavery and the bible as a moral guide

    You said it was immoral to lie to this person, so it must be moral to have to have told the truth?

    ---------- Post added at 06:19 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:04 PM ----------


    ...
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    Re: Objective morality vs. subjective morality

    Well, that is EXACTLY what you are saying here!! It might be "reality", but again, you haven't supported at all, that it would be necessarily "superior" in any way.
    Any entity with sufficient power...
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