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  1. #1
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    The video banned from ODN....

    Carlos Mencia - Mind Of Mencia


    Carlos Mencia - Mind Of Mencia


    First you need to check out this videolink above.....(if you are overly sensitive you won't want to...but then you probably should not be at this thread anyhow.)

    What's in a word?

    Is it necessary for thought police to ban this video linked here? It is a sad day when people can not in good-humor poke fun at themselves and each other.

    Is it a slur to use a nick name to describe a person when they use that name themselves and don't mind other people using it?

    Is it wrong to acknowledge that white people like mayonaise, Black people are good at basketball, and Mexicans tend to be short?

    Sure broad sweeping generaities, but so what? Is it not healthy to embrace in good nature the things that make our subcultures unique, quirky, funny. What is wrong with that?

    What's wrong with laughing at ourselves and joining in when others laugh at themselves?A slur is meant to hurt. But what about when a word is intended as a jovial term?
    Last edited by Spartacus; February 8th, 2008 at 02:20 PM.

  2. #2
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    Re: The video banned from ODN....

    Quote Originally Posted by Rules
    Challenging of Staff Decisions
    While any decision made by a staff member should be clarified upon request, the idea of formally challenging that decision is a fairly complicated one. We are looking into the possibility of having a way to publicly do this, but are not convinced that using a forum like system would be appropriate.

    What you can do however in the public forum (Site Feedback), is ask for clarification of the rules or even the clarification of the decision made by a staff member. This is quite different than disputing the decision itself we believe.
    Ya clarifying or challenging?

  3. #3
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    Re: The video banned from ODN....

    The problem is that anyone who uses the slur to hurt someone could claim that he intended it as a jovial term.
    If I am capable of grasping God objectively, I do not believe, but precisely because I cannot do this I must believe. - Soren Kierkegaard
    **** you, I won't do what you tell me

    HOLY CRAP MY BLOG IS AWESOME

  4. #4
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    Re: The video banned from ODN....

    Yeah. Like this:

    Quote Originally Posted by Spartacus View Post
    But what about when a word is intended as a jovial term?[/B]
    "Christians; they're so deluded and silly lol! They worship a cosmic jewish zombie."

    You're cool with the above, right? Because I intended it to be jovial, right?

  5. #5
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    Re: The video banned from ODN....

    Quote Originally Posted by Spartacus View Post


    Is it a slur to use a nick name to describe a person when they use that name themselves and don't mind other people using it?

    Please note the stipulation above.

  6. #6
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    Re: The video banned from ODN....

    Quote Originally Posted by Spartacus View Post
    Please note the stipulation above.
    Why?

    Why does using the name on yourself matter? I don't need to find democrats who call themselves "liberal whack jobs" to call them liberal whack jobs. Why should I care if it's a term you use or not?

  7. #7
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    Re: The video banned from ODN....

    Quote Originally Posted by Zhavric View Post
    You're cool with the above, right? Because I intended it to be jovial, right?
    No you did not.Now had I or someone else here made such a statement in a self-depricating way, then that would be different. Or if it was also a statement that wasknown amongst a large demographic to be intended as a jovial statment that would also be different.

  8. #8
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    Re: The video banned from ODN....

    I'm aware that Mencia uses the term regularly in his routine. I do not believe he is racist against his own people. I also believe you were merely mimicking his routine. I also believe that you were not showing racism against Mexicans in this instance.

    However, is that something we wish to allow here? If so, then all groups should have equality and use "jovial terms" that in most circumstances, would indeed be offensive.

    For example, many black comics use the word "n*gger" in their routine. Should ODN then allow the use of that word...merely because other people outside of ODN use it in fun? Should we ignore the fact that most of the time its use is intended as derogatory and instead, rely on the exception to make the rule?

    Also, of what use does a racial term that is predominately derogatory in nature, have in debate?

    It's easy to whine and name call (which is what I see you doing Spart by the way you've worded your complaint) when you are not responsible for keeping the peace (especially when your participation in a community is "part-time" at best). It is a lot more complicated when you are responsible for juggling several balls at once, trying to keep the peace, having to deal with several diverse groups and create an atmosphere that is conducive to debate vs personal remarks and attacks.

    Your usage of the term is only benign to someone who understands the Mencia routine. Lurkers who may not know Mencia, may arrive at the perfectly reasonable conclusion that it was a racist remark and the staff doesn't care.

    For you, it's just wanting to be cute. For me, it's wanting to create a happy, diverse, consistent, non-confrontational (when it comes to personal issues like race, gender, etc...), community that grows in traffic and in members.

    There's nothing at stake for you except one or two readers getting a slight smile on their face. There's everything at stake for me.

    It isn't about being the "thought police", it's about responsibility, setting precedents and creating a productive environment for as many people as possible.
    -=]Apokalupsis[=-
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    I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. - Thomas Jefferson




  9. #9
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    Re: The video banned from ODN....

    You're cool with the above, right? Because I intended it to be jovial, right?
    Except that yours is allowed. If you're suggesting that your example is an analog to Spart's term, then you must agree that, like Spart's term, it should be banned, right?
    If I am capable of grasping God objectively, I do not believe, but precisely because I cannot do this I must believe. - Soren Kierkegaard
    **** you, I won't do what you tell me

    HOLY CRAP MY BLOG IS AWESOME

  10. #10
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    Re: The video banned from ODN....

    Quote Originally Posted by Spartacus View Post
    No you did not.
    Thank you for proving the flaw in your argumentation. "Jovial" is often in the eye of the beholder, not the speaker.

    Now had I or someone else here made such a statement in a self-depricating way, then that would be different.
    How?

    If I found a new agey liberal Christian who was okay with jovially referring to Jesus as a "cosmic Jewish zombie" would you be any less insulted?

    Or if it was also a statement that wasknown amongst a large demographic to be intended as a jovial statment that would also be different.
    Appeal to popular opinion fallacy. "Everyone thinks it's okay, so it must not be insulting."


    _________________________________ Post Merged _________________________________


    Quote Originally Posted by CliveStaples View Post
    Except that yours is allowed. If you're suggesting that your example is an analog to Spart's term, then you must agree that, like Spart's term, it should be banned, right?
    I agree it's insulting, but that's a moot point. It's not impossible to think that it could be meant as a joke. I chose a religious slur because they aren't specifically banned on ODN. I've been racking up points lately, so what the hell: I could have made some comment about "white trash". White commedians call other white people white trash, but some white people are deeply offended by that term regardless of where it comes from. Under Sparti's reasoning, it's cool if I call people white trash because I mean it as a joke... and I should be able to just say, "screw you if you don't think it's funny". That's his argument and it doesn't work.
    Last edited by Zhavric; February 8th, 2008 at 12:39 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

  11. #11
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    Re: The video banned from ODN....

    Under Sparti's reasoning, it's cool if I call people white trash because I mean it as a joke... and I should be able to just say, "screw you if you don't think it's funny". That's his argument and it doesn't work.
    Except that it does work...for everything except racial slurs, arbitrarily.
    If I am capable of grasping God objectively, I do not believe, but precisely because I cannot do this I must believe. - Soren Kierkegaard
    **** you, I won't do what you tell me

    HOLY CRAP MY BLOG IS AWESOME

  12. #12
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    Re: The video banned from ODN....

    Quote Originally Posted by CliveStaples View Post
    Except that it does work...for everything except racial slurs, arbitrarily.
    O_o

    We just got done agreeing it doesn't work for religion.

  13. #13
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    Re: The video banned from ODN....

    We just got done agreeing it doesn't work for religion.
    Spart's argument is that "we should be allowed to say [x] if we meant it in jest, even if it gives offense." It's true for all values of x, except x = racial slur. A religious slur? Sure, that's fine. A political slur? Great! Casting an aspersion upon another member's mother? Absolutely fine. A racial slur...no way, Jose.
    If I am capable of grasping God objectively, I do not believe, but precisely because I cannot do this I must believe. - Soren Kierkegaard
    **** you, I won't do what you tell me

    HOLY CRAP MY BLOG IS AWESOME

  14. #14
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    Re: The video banned from ODN....

    I think one should be able to safely use certain words and phrases without someone taking offense to it.

    "White Trash" for example that no one would find obejectionble, because the only ones claiming membership in that group do so in gest.

    The same is true for "Red Neck"

    It is I think in large part to the work of comedians like Carlos Mencia and Jeff Foxworthy -- who have become rich by embracing these "slurs" -- that society at large does not find such terms "offensive"

    Humor is a healthy thing. It is I think important that issues are taken seriously, but that we never take ourselves so seriously that we can not find humor and have fun by pointing out little quirks that people hear (or read) and think 'o yeah...well the guy is right you know we are like that."

    To quote from "Greg the Bunny"

    "C'mon everybody knows you puppets like tartar sauce....admit it now c'mon...."

 

 

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