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  1. #1
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    Theory about nothing...

    If nothing is nothing then nothing is not there. But nothing has to be there to be nothing? if you can see though nothing but cant understand nothing then nothing still dosent exist. But wait, nothing is like air...you can see though it but there is still something. But then agin that would mean that there is something not nothing...but nothing and not something. if something is nothing and nothing is something then nothing does no longer equal nothing...right?
    Nothing is 0 we are 1 (because 1 person)
    PIcture 1 looking into nothing... 1 looking at 0. 0 around 1. 1 around 0. but still that would make 0 a value, or a place holder. that means that 0 = something which means nothing != nothing. Nothing is something, so then nothing is no longer nothing. But wait this still does not make sence! Nothing is nothing. not there not a glimps of air like the wind on stone or black in the cone. You look and see nothing...but still there is something...BUT It cannot be nothing if there is soemthing! but why...if nothing = something then whats the purpose of nothing...
    Does nothing=something? or does nothing = nothing or does nothing = something but on occasions nothing = nothing...
    -Vance101's theory about nothing...

  2. #2
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    Re: Theory about nothing...

    You already answered your question.
    Do or do not, there is no try. - Master Jedi Yoda
    He's Kermit on acid who happens to carry a big stick when pissed off. Big deal. - Apokalupsis
    Actually, didn't Frank Oz do Bert as well? We're cousins! - Withnail in reference to Bert and Yoda

  3. #3
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    Re: Theory about nothing...

    vance101: Your discourse on nothing felt like a long journey that progressed me to my start point. Still, at least I did achieve - NOTHING.
    "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." - Anais Nin.
    Emitte lucem et veritatem - Send out light and truth.
    'Fere libenter homines id quod volunt credunt' - Julius Caesar (rough translation, 'Men will think what they want to think')
    Kill my boss? Do I dare live out the American dream? - Homer Simpson.

  4. #4
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    Re: Theory about nothing...

    Nothing is either:
    The lack of existence of a thing OR
    The existence of no thing.

    This reeks of Strong and Weak atheism
    Fortunately, the darkest of darkness is not as terrible as we fear.
    Unfortunately, the lightest of light, all things good, are not so wonderful as we hope for them to be.
    What, then, is left, but various shades of grey neutrality? Where are the heroes and villains? All I see are people.

  5. #5
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    Re: Theory about nothing...

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyshhed
    This reeks of Strong and Weak atheism
    Tis not!
    Do or do not, there is no try. - Master Jedi Yoda
    He's Kermit on acid who happens to carry a big stick when pissed off. Big deal. - Apokalupsis
    Actually, didn't Frank Oz do Bert as well? We're cousins! - Withnail in reference to Bert and Yoda

  6. #6
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    Re: Theory about nothing...

    Quote Originally Posted by vance101
    If nothing is nothing then nothing is not there. But nothing has to be there to be nothing? if you can see though nothing but cant understand nothing then nothing still dosent exist. But wait, nothing is like air...you can see though it but there is still something. But then agin that would mean that there is something not nothing...but nothing and not something. if something is nothing and nothing is something then nothing does no longer equal nothing...right?
    Nothing is 0 we are 1 (because 1 person)
    PIcture 1 looking into nothing... 1 looking at 0. 0 around 1. 1 around 0. but still that would make 0 a value, or a place holder. that means that 0 = something which means nothing != nothing. Nothing is something, so then nothing is no longer nothing. But wait this still does not make sence! Nothing is nothing. not there not a glimps of air like the wind on stone or black in the cone. You look and see nothing...but still there is something...BUT It cannot be nothing if there is soemthing! but why...if nothing = something then whats the purpose of nothing...
    Does nothing=something? or does nothing = nothing or does nothing = something but on occasions nothing = nothing...
    -Vance101's theory about nothing...

    "Nothing" is something in the sense that it is a concept or an idea. There is no such thing as true nothingness today. There was truly no thing (nothing), as in even the lack of this concept, before the Creation, but it is impossible for us to grasp this concept fully, because even when we attempt to think of nothing, that thought is still of "something", whether it is of the color black, or white, or whatever. That's my take on it.

  7. #7
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    Re: Theory about nothing...

    Nothing, isn't "something"...it is the LACK of something. Like darkness is the absence of light, cold the absence of heat, nothing is the absence of something.
    -=]Apokalupsis[=-
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    I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. - Thomas Jefferson




  8. #8
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    Re: Theory about nothing...

    Seems like something and nothing to me.

    'Out of the strong came forth sweetness' - I can go for.
    Out of nothingness came forth something is still a mystery - back to the science books, according to scientific rationalism all the answers are there. - Nope, can't spot a dickie bird on the explanation of infinity and something from nothing that does not seem far fetched in comparison with the New Testament.
    "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." - Anais Nin.
    Emitte lucem et veritatem - Send out light and truth.
    'Fere libenter homines id quod volunt credunt' - Julius Caesar (rough translation, 'Men will think what they want to think')
    Kill my boss? Do I dare live out the American dream? - Homer Simpson.

  9. #9
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    Re: Theory about nothing...

    Alright - I think what his theory is trying to get at is a little mathematical problem called 0/0 (0 divided by 0). Lets think back to our rules of division - anything divided by itself is 1. 0 divided by anything is 0. Anything divided by 0 is undefined. Hmm... which one do we apply, and which two do we break? Well, luckily, algebra has provided us an alternative.

    t=0

    x=t/t
    tx=t
    0x=0

    Now, look at this - any value of x will make this statement true! So in stead of undefined, to describe this. Mathematics points to something that keeps those three rules intact, and this algebraic expression true by assigning the word 'indeterminable' to this problem. So what that means is the value of it cannot be ascertained - it may have multiple values (considering a single instant of course), or it may have just one value.

    So how does this apply to what vance is talking about? Consider 'empty' space his definition of nothing. Apply the equation with the sentence, how many nothings can fit into nothing? Of course, our limited definition of the concept nothing destroys our ability to think on this, but let's try. We cannot answer this question, but it is a matter of potential. We can consider this vast nothing, something. Why? Because you CAN fill it (traversing it). Because it is in fact set - 500 miles is 500 miles. Because energy can flow through it (light, alpha-, beta-, gamma-, x-, uv-, micro-, infrared rays, and just about anything else you may wish to consider.

    Ultimately, just as vance answered his own question, this same process leads to a similar conclusion:

    Nothing is not a good word to describe 'empty' space, because it has potential to be/carry something.

    Nothing indicates an absolute void (void of time, space, matter, energy), which has no potential.
    I think, therefore I am. Thus, while I sleep, I am not! Could this be why time appears to have no bearing while asleep, because you do not exist? What is time? What defines existence? A body, a mind, a soul? Thus, I envy those that die, for they have the answers. Yet, what is death? Does the sentience of an entity cease to be at the time the body fails? We shall all see one day. ;?

  10. #10
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    Re: Theory about nothing...

    Nothing, has NO potential whatsoever to be something. It is by very definition, the lack of something. Once something is introduced, "nothing" is gone, and something is now there.
    -=]Apokalupsis[=-
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    I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. - Thomas Jefferson




  11. #11
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    Re: Theory about nothing...

    Quote Originally Posted by Apokalupsis
    Nothing, has NO potential whatsoever to be something. It is by very definition, the lack of something. Once something is introduced, "nothing" is gone, and something is now there.
    I see your point here, but it seems obvious that true nothingness has the potential to become something, since nothing is what God created the universe from. Granted, without the supernatural force of the Creator, the nothing would have unquestionably remained absolutely nothing.

  12. #12
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    Re: Theory about nothing...

    I hope neither of you two are commenting directly on what I wrote - because if you read it closely, you would realize that what I am saying is that 'nothing' is a misnomer for 'empty space' because of it's potential to be filled, and the other reasons I said. I clearly stated what true nothingness is, and Apok is correct that nothing=nothing.
    I think, therefore I am. Thus, while I sleep, I am not! Could this be why time appears to have no bearing while asleep, because you do not exist? What is time? What defines existence? A body, a mind, a soul? Thus, I envy those that die, for they have the answers. Yet, what is death? Does the sentience of an entity cease to be at the time the body fails? We shall all see one day. ;?

  13. #13
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    Re: Theory about nothing...

    Nothingness doesn't CHANGE, it doesn't have the potential to do any such thing. Nothingness, ceases to be when something is present. By definition, you cannot have nothing and something in the same sense. For one is the absence of the other.

    When we have nothing, and something is then added, that "nothing" is now gone. Since we have something, nothing is out of the picture by it very definition.

    God didn't create "out of nothing". He didn't USE nothing to create something. What he created merely REPLACED nothing so that it became something.

    -=]Apokalupsis[=-
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    I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. - Thomas Jefferson




  14. #14
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    Re: Theory about nothing...

    I hope neither of you two are commenting directly on what I wrote - because if you read it closely, you would realize that what I am saying is that 'nothing' is a misnomer for 'empty space' because of it's potential to be filled, and the other reasons I said. I clearly stated what true nothingness is, and Apok is correct that nothing=nothing.
    When I think of all this talk of empty space, I think of the empty space in our universe and then I remember that this empty space also exerts a force. That doesnt sound like nothing to me.
    I typically cite original research papers and reviews that are available only to a personal or institutional subscriptional. If you wish a PDF copy of the papers I cite, send me a request.

  15. #15
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    Re: Theory about nothing...

    Nothing != empty space. That is not the concept of "nothing" by any means. Not a single philosopher in the history of the world has ever posited such a claim.

    Also, nothing does not exert force. It's a logical impossibility. Something that does not exist cannot act.
    -=]Apokalupsis[=-
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  16. #16
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    Re: Theory about nothing...

    Quote Originally Posted by Apokalupsis
    Nothing != empty space. That is not the concept of "nothing" by any means. Not a single philosopher in the history of the world has ever posited such a claim.

    Also, nothing does not exert force. It's a logical impossibility. Something that does not exist cannot act.
    Apok, please refer to exactly what part of my post you are talking about, because your responses lead me to believe that you have not actually read my post for understanding but rather have skimmed through it. I have never claimed that nothing is something. I clearly stated, as I will now quote:
    Quote Originally Posted by ME
    Nothing indicates an absolute void (void of time, space, matter, energy), which has no potential
    I simply said, and now I'll say for the third time until you confirm that you understand what I am saying, that labeling empty space as nothing is a misnomer, because it simply is not nothing.
    I think, therefore I am. Thus, while I sleep, I am not! Could this be why time appears to have no bearing while asleep, because you do not exist? What is time? What defines existence? A body, a mind, a soul? Thus, I envy those that die, for they have the answers. Yet, what is death? Does the sentience of an entity cease to be at the time the body fails? We shall all see one day. ;?

  17. #17
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    Re: Theory about nothing...

    I dont think therefore I am not? ;?

    But therefore = a conclusion, how can I get a conclusion from not thinking...AIIYAYAI!!
    Do or do not, there is no try. - Master Jedi Yoda
    He's Kermit on acid who happens to carry a big stick when pissed off. Big deal. - Apokalupsis
    Actually, didn't Frank Oz do Bert as well? We're cousins! - Withnail in reference to Bert and Yoda

  18. #18
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    Re: Theory about nothing...

    Vork, I'm responding to Chad, not you.
    -=]Apokalupsis[=-
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  19. #19
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    Re: Theory about nothing...

    Nothing indicates an absolute void (void of time, space, matter, energy), which has no potential
    but if nothing is not there and cannot be seen and is an absolute void, then there must be something there? right? dark matter...Nothing cannot exist without something. nothing is not nothing unless something is there...but does that mean that nothing dosent = nothing agin? but as some one else said nothing = absence of something. but it still would not be nothing...it would be something the abesence of something around nothing... Nothing is an igma once more!
    t=0

    x=t/t
    tx=t
    0x=0

    Now, look at this - any value of x will make this statement true! So in stead of undefined, to describe this. Mathematics points to something that keeps those three rules intact, and this algebraic expression true by assigning the word 'indeterminable' to this problem. So what that means is the value of it cannot be ascertained - it may have multiple values (considering a single instant of course), or it may have just one value.
    hmm after thinking long and hard... It cant have multiple values, 0 =0 1=1 if x = 1 then t = 1 they both have the same values there not diffrent...or if x = 0 and t=0 or if you prove that useing t and its equal makes x 0 then...0 is something...its a place holder for something else. Thus it is something...or wait, does that mean that with nothing comes something? if nothing = nothing then we would not exist, even christianity states that nothing = something. Some way shape or for god is there from nothing. From the big bang nothing = something... but to be nothing you must have nothing...or is nothing even plausable...

  20. #20
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    Re: Theory about nothing...

    Quote Originally Posted by Apokalupsis
    Nothingness doesn't CHANGE, it doesn't have the potential to do any such thing. Nothingness, ceases to be when something is present. By definition, you cannot have nothing and something in the same sense. For one is the absence of the other.

    When we have nothing, and something is then added, that "nothing" is now gone. Since we have something, nothing is out of the picture by it very definition.

    God didn't create "out of nothing". He didn't USE nothing to create something. What he created merely REPLACED nothing so that it became something.

    Right. "Out of nothing" is merely a figure of speech, meaning that solely through God's creative energy and will, everything was created. However, nothing existed before this, except God, Who is supernatural, so physically there really was nothing. So you're right, it didn't REPLACE nothing, because nothing doesn't take up a place. But it did cause nothing not to exist anymore, or in other words, something to exist. Is my logic coherent here?

 

 
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