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Thread: Global warming.

  1. #21
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    Re: Global warming.

    And now the US govt. is trying to keep the oil as the primary energy source by killing the competition:
    http://www.popsci.com/science/articl...uld-be-america

    This kind of unsupported behavior will continue the CO and CO2 emission high.

    So yes, I believe man is contributing to the warming of the earth, but this is just another phase in earth's history (don't get me wrong-I'm Jewish) and it will pass if we handle it correctly. We must do it as humanity by setting aside our differences and fighting for our planet. God save America. *clapping throughout audience*

  2. #22
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    Re: Global warming.

    Global warming is it happening? Are we causing it? Can we do anything about it?
    Dont know. Probably not. Not a thing

  3. #23

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    Re: Global warming.

    the only solution to overpopulation is war and or a good old virus that targets and kills half of earths population.

    ---------- Post added at 09:13 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:12 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by daidog57 View Post
    Global warming is it happening? Are we causing it? Can we do anything about it?
    Dont know. Probably not. Not a thing
    probably not???? what else would be causing it trees dead animals or millions upon millions of cars!?

  4. #24
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    Re: Global warming.

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg858 View Post
    I feel that the basic driving force behind global warming is overpopulation, which is getting worse. In the United States at present the black, white, and Asian birth rate is OK, but there is one group that has too many children both in their home countries and in the US, and I doubt if this will change. Does anyone have any suggestions on how to cope with this reality?
    Global warming isn't a serious problem for approximately another billion years, however the burning of fossil fuels et cetera doesn't help.

  5. #25
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    Re: Global warming.

    Quote Originally Posted by DC3000X View Post
    Global warming isn't a serious problem for approximately another billion years...
    Please support this statement.

  6. #26
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    Re: Global warming.

    Is 'overpopulation' causing global warming? Well, yes and no.

    Its been pointed out that much of the CO2 comes from the USA which is not densely populated, Americans just produce a lot of greenhouse gases.

    Countries with high population growth like some African countries also have a minute carbon footprint.

    So its not just numbers, its how much you use.

    Where the footprint will go through the roof is in China and India. 2.4 billion people live in those two countries, a third the people in the world. Those two economies have expanded greatly in recent years and some of the wealth reaches the ordinary people. They might get their first car for example, and that is a big increase in their carbon footprint. America has probably reached is footprint peak, but China and India have a very long way to go.

    But its Americans that should cut down. Their footprint is 5 times bigger than it should be.

    ---------- Post added at 01:05 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:53 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by disinterested View Post
    Agreed; but to expand a touch: the smuggled premise is that Global Warming exists NOW and that it is anthropogenic.

    There is no doubt that global warming has existed in the past - ice ages and their reversals - but there is considerable doubt today on two counts; that world climate is currently in a long term warming phase and b )if it is, whether this is caused by man's activities.

    For an excellent book on the subject, one that takes a sceptical view of the current panic surrounding this topic, I recommend the following:

    Heaven And Earth: Global Warming - The Missing Science
    Ok I googled the book and to paraphrase on review, if this guy has trashed the work of thousands of scientists over the last 100 years and the scientific consensus he would be world famous. And he isn't a climate scientist in any shape or form.

    Why doesn't he publish some proper peer-reviewed research?

    This review tears him to pieces

    http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news...-1225710387147

    example

    "He recycles a graph, without attribution, from Martin Durkin's Great Global Warming Swindle documentary, neglecting even to make the changes that Durkin made following an outcry over the fact that the past two decades of temperature measurements had been mysteriously deleted."

  7. #27
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    Re: Global warming.

    Quote Originally Posted by manc View Post
    But its Americans that should cut down. Their footprint is 5 times bigger than it should be.
    According to who? Why don't you just claim our footprint is a gazillion billion times too big? This is little more than an opinion. Whose? I have no idea and am not particularly interested.
    The U.S. is currently enduring a zombie apocalypse. However, in a strange twist, the zombie's are starving.

  8. #28
    kanch
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    Re: Global warming.

    So we all know how dangerous global warming is and how huge of an environmental issue it is in the world today, but did you know that there are things that you can do which will help to protect the environment and to prevent global warming as best we can.

  9. #29
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    Re: Global warming.

    Quote Originally Posted by kanch View Post
    So we all know how dangerous global warming is and how huge of an environmental issue it is in the world today, but did you know that there are things that you can do which will help to protect the environment and to prevent global warming as best we can.
    Yeah there certainly are kanch, welcome to the forum. Maybe you could expand on this.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ibelsd View Post
    According to who? Why don't you just claim our footprint is a gazillion billion times too big? This is little more than an opinion. Whose? I have no idea and am not particularly interested.

    Footprint Network and so on

    http://www.footprintnetwork.org/en/index.php/GFN/

    Methodology, team members, all described there. This is an international organisation working with governments.

    Actually I suspect the true figure is more than 5.

    What it means is that Americans use 5 times more resources than the planet could cope with for everyone to live , or to put it another way if everyone lived like an America you would need 5 planets.

    I spoke to an academic on this who was inn Greenpeace and she was saying it was probably a lot more than 5.

  10. #30
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    Re: Global warming.

    Quote Originally Posted by manc View Post
    Methodology, team members, all described there. This is an international organisation working with governments.

    Actually I suspect the true figure is more than 5.

    What it means is that Americans use 5 times more resources than the planet could cope with for everyone to live , or to put it another way if everyone lived like an America you would need 5 planets.

    I spoke to an academic on this who was inn Greenpeace and she was saying it was probably a lot more than 5.
    rofl, everyone on this planet could live like Rush Limbaugh permanently.

    Forests cannot be slain, the land they are on can be used and the moment it isn't being used it will be a forest again.

    We do not consume water.

    We do not consume carbon.

    We do not consume metal or rock.

    The only thing we consume, we permanently use up is energy and the sun's got us covered for a few billion more years in that department.

  11. #31
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    Re: Global warming.

    Quote Originally Posted by Liberty View Post
    We do not consume water.
    Since when do we not consume water?
    Udabindu yathāpi pokkhare
    Padume vāri yathā na lippati,
    Evaṃ muni no palippati
    Yadidaṃ diṭṭhasutaṃ mutesu vā.

  12. #32
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    Re: Global warming.

    Quote Originally Posted by Liberty View Post
    rofl, everyone on this planet could live like Rush Limbaugh permanently.

    Forests cannot be slain, the land they are on can be used and the moment it isn't being used it will be a forest again.

    We do not consume water.

    We do not consume carbon.

    We do not consume metal or rock.

    The only thing we consume, we permanently use up is energy and the sun's got us covered for a few billion more years in that department.
    We don't consume carbon we do the opposite and that's the problem. We increase the amount of carbon in the atmosphere.

    Of course we consume water. Do you know what an aquifer is? Water deep underground that has accumulated over thousands of years. We mine it. We pollute water as well. Do you know that a glass of milk contains 200 litres of embedded water, and 1kg of beef contains 22,000 litres?

    We do consume metal if we mine it, use it, and dont recycle it but put it in landfill instead.

    As for forests, some take thousands of years to grow back.

  13. #33
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    Re: Global warming.

    Quote Originally Posted by manc View Post
    We don't consume carbon we do the opposite and that's the problem. We increase the amount of carbon in the atmosphere.
    Which is only a problem if an increase of life is a problem. I don't think it is, more life who cares if it isn't exactly as it was a thousand years ago if it's better?

    Quote Originally Posted by manc View Post
    Of course we consume water. Do you know what an aquifer is? Water deep underground that has accumulated over thousands of years. We mine it. We pollute water as well. Do you know that a glass of milk contains 200 litres of embedded water, and 1kg of beef contains 22,000 litres?
    I hate to have to be the one who tells you this... but.... (it comes back out).

    Quote Originally Posted by manc View Post
    We do consume metal if we mine it, use it, and dont recycle it but put it in landfill instead.
    Right because the landfill monsters then drop it all into the void.

    Quote Originally Posted by manc View Post
    As for forests, some take thousands of years to grow back.
    Which forests would these be?

  14. #34
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    Re: Global warming.

    Quote Originally Posted by Liberty View Post

    I hate to have to be the one who tells you this... but.... (it comes back out).
    Right but that doesn't mean we don't consume water. Not all of it comes back out, either. A good amount is lost through the air by sweat. And for the stuff the does come back out, it takes machinery and energy to clean it. And unless your suggesting we wear stillsuits, like in Dune, what do we do about the lost water through the air?
    Udabindu yathāpi pokkhare
    Padume vāri yathā na lippati,
    Evaṃ muni no palippati
    Yadidaṃ diṭṭhasutaṃ mutesu vā.

  15. #35
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    Re: Global warming.

    Quote Originally Posted by Liberty View Post
    Which is only a problem if an increase of life is a problem. I don't think it is, more life who cares if it isn't exactly as it was a thousand years ago if it's better?
    I'm talking about global warming

    Quote Originally Posted by Liberty View Post
    I hate to have to be the one who tells you this... but.... (it comes back out).
    Let me give you some facts

    Only 3% of the water on the planet is fresh water.

    The water from aquifers is mined. It is not replaced. If is is used to irrigate crops it will take hundreds of years to get back into the aquifers. Some will end up in the sea. Water tables are falling in India, China and the USA.

    884 million people have inadequate access to clean drinking water

    2.5 billion people have inadequate access to water for sanitation and so on.

    One of the leading causes of death in the world is lack of clean water and the associated water born diseases. For children under the age of 5 this is the biggest killer.

    The worlds population is projected to grow by 3 billion and most will be born in countries with water shortages.

    Israel bans the export of oranges because of the huge amount of embedded water.

    4,000 children a day die from diseases associated with unsafe water.

    Most of the water consumed in the UK is imported from other countries, in the form of embedded water. "According to the Institute of Civil Engineers (ICE) over two thirds of the water used by those living in Britain is 'imported', often from countries already [/URL]suffering from shortages."



    Quote Originally Posted by Liberty View Post

    Which forests would these be?
    rain forests take about 400 years to regenerate completely. Some trees are a thousand years old. Hardwood forests in America can exhibit old growth characteristics in 150-500 years. Forests trap huge amounts of carbon in soil and roots, this is all released if the forest is flattened. Forests are mainly chopped down to make more room for agriculture.

    Rainforest regeneration might take up to 4000 years
    London, June 12 (ANI): A new study has suggested that for a rainforest to regenerate completely, it might take up to 4000 years.

    According to a report in New Scientist, the study, which focused on the Brazilian Atlantic forest, determined that though certain aspects of a rainforest may return in just 65 years, for the landscape to truly regain its native identity takes a lot longer up to 4000 years.
    http://www.thaindian.com/newsportal/..._10059292.html

  16. #36
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    Re: Global warming.

    Quote Originally Posted by Soren View Post
    Right but that doesn't mean we don't consume water. Not all of it comes back out, either. A good amount is lost through the air by sweat. And for the stuff the does come back out, it takes machinery and energy to clean it. And unless your suggesting we wear stillsuits, like in Dune, what do we do about the lost water through the air?
    It takes no machinery nor energy except that which exists in a swamp.

    Oh I forgot about sweating, I mean we all know air moisture is lost to us forever.
    Quote Originally Posted by manc View Post
    I'm talking about global warming
    As the people who are quoting 'five planets' probably.

    Quote Originally Posted by manc View Post
    The water from aquifers is mined. It is not replaced.
    You mean not replaced fast enough I hope.

    Quote Originally Posted by manc View Post
    If is is used to irrigate crops it will take hundreds of years to get back into the aquifers. Some will end up in the sea. Water tables are falling in India, China and the USA.
    I never claimed that we wouldn't have to build anything, we aren't going to get to use coal much longer. In this case we will have to construct aqueducts (assuming you are correct about our dependence on slowly recharged ground water).

    When the next ice age comes around we will have to choose among various constructs to save us.

    Quote Originally Posted by manc View Post
    884 million people have inadequate access to clean drinking water

    2.5 billion people have inadequate access to water for sanitation and so on.

    One of the leading causes of death in the world is lack of clean water and the associated water born diseases. For children under the age of 5 this is the biggest killer.

    The worlds population is projected to grow by 3 billion and most will be born in countries with water shortages.

    Israel bans the export of oranges because of the huge amount of embedded water.

    4,000 children a day die from diseases associated with unsafe water.
    Which obviously indicates that too many people are using water (to me it screams that not enough people are using water).

    Quote Originally Posted by manc View Post
    rain forests take about 400 years to regenerate completely. Some trees are a thousand years old. Hardwood forests in America can exhibit old growth characteristics in 150-500 years. Forests trap huge amounts of carbon in soil and roots, this is all released if the forest is flattened. Forests are mainly chopped down to make more room for agriculture.


    http://www.thaindian.com/newsportal/..._10059292.html
    [/QUOTE]
    The thousand year old ones do not contain significantly more carbon than a 65 year old tree. If you are referring to the carbon in the leaf litter people grow crops over the pete.

  17. #37
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    Re: Global warming.

    Quote Originally Posted by Liberty View Post

    As the people who are quoting 'five planets' probably.
    Not just global warming though. The reason why we would need 5 planets for everyone to live like an American is because of various factors. CO2 is a big one, also there are various other factors, it includes everything about your life, the resources that are required for it and the waste it produces. For more see my Global Resources thread. Water obviously is another. Everything we use has limited supplies.

    Quote Originally Posted by Liberty View Post
    You mean not replaced fast enough I hope.
    obviously, but it is very slow. In India for example they keep digging wells deeper and deeper. There is a limit.

    Quote Originally Posted by Liberty View Post
    I never claimed that we wouldn't have to build anything, we aren't going to get to use coal much longer. In this case we will have to construct aqueducts (assuming you are correct about our dependence on slowly recharged ground water).
    And where is the water gonna come from?




    Quote Originally Posted by Liberty View Post
    When the next ice age comes around we will have to choose among various constructs to save us.
    The glaciation might not be for 15,000 to 50,000 years. We are already in an ice age.

    Quote Originally Posted by Liberty View Post
    Which obviously indicates that too many people are using water (to me it screams that not enough people are using water).
    Too many people, not enough water, not enough clean water. It's a complicated mix of poverty and limits of natural resources, plus population increase. 95% of the water an America uses is embedded water. Poor countries are exporting vitally needed embedded water to rich ones, eg Kenyan beans flown to the UK. America actually is a net exporter of embedded water. However the point is Americans have a lot of water and they use a lot of water, but the rest of the world does not have so much water. America has a low population density and a temperate climate, so its only in the south where America has water shortages.


    Quote Originally Posted by Liberty View Post

    The thousand year old ones do not contain significantly more carbon than a 65 year old tree. If you are referring to the carbon in the leaf litter people grow crops over the pete.

    It's complicated. New growth absorbs carbon, but when a rain forest is felled there is tons of CO2 released from the soil as well as the wood. Plus they are usually replaced with land for crops to feed cows, and I don't think that takes up much carbon, in fact the meat industry is one of the worst causes of global warming (see my 'why the world should go vegetarian' thread.)

  18. #38
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    Re: Global warming.

    Quote Originally Posted by Soren View Post
    Right but that doesn't mean we don't consume water. Not all of it comes back out, either. A good amount is lost through the air by sweat. And for the stuff the does come back out, it takes machinery and energy to clean it. And unless your suggesting we wear stillsuits, like in Dune, what do we do about the lost water through the air?
    We don't "lose" it to the air. Water is in a state of "constant cycle".

  19. #39
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    Re: Global warming.

    It all depends where you are. In Israel they are so concerned about evaporation they publish daily data from various sites. The Israeli government say evaporation rates are increasing along with increasing temperatures. In a rainforest water evaporates and comes back down as rain. In Australia evaporation rates can be several times rainfall rates. One solution might be a form of agriculture called wicking beds. You grow food with less water and also capture carbon at the same time. Another problem is if the rain happens all in one go, and you dont have the right vegetation. The soil, which takes hundreds of years to form, gets washed away. Global warming accelerates things, causing more evaporation and flooding.

    Ardi and semi-arid areas are expected to see a decrease in precipitation.

  20. #40
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    Re: Global warming.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dionysus View Post
    We don't "lose" it to the air. Water is in a state of "constant cycle".
    But to harvest back that water it takes resources. My point was that we couldn't live solely off of the water that comes out of our....err behind. Because that is not where all of the water we consume goes.
    Udabindu yathāpi pokkhare
    Padume vāri yathā na lippati,
    Evaṃ muni no palippati
    Yadidaṃ diṭṭhasutaṃ mutesu vā.

 

 
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