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Poll: Do you believe that atheists are discrimanated against?

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  1. #21
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    Re: The most hated minority?

    Quote Originally Posted by thegreenape View Post
    I guess I would say pick your battles.

    As far as your son goes, I don't think it is necessary to leave the room during th Pledge. Yes, I know it says "Under God" but it's more about the country. Plus, you do use money which has God on it as well. 13 is difficult enough.

    And I mean, DAMN he's 6'1'' 200+ lb 13 year old. He can handle himself, it seems.

    As far as you go...well, I would suggest avoid religious talk at work at all costs. I work with 3 devout Southern Baptists (and im in the South) and I just do not bring up or talk about religion. However, knowing the culture i knwo this is an integral part of lots of people's lives. So, many times its the first questino they ask you.

    As far as your friends go, if you want to keep them, takl with thim about tolerance and sit down and at least have a discussion about the whole thing. I wouldn't attack them but merely respect their faith and ask for their respect in turn.

    However, if the still choose to distance themselvse or treat you poorly...I wouldn't waste my time.

    Finally, if you can prove you didn't get a job or were fired from a job wrongly...fight back because its illegal and wrong.
    Thanks Oh Green one :-)

    My son leaves the room because he feels very strongly about being true to himself. And there has been at least 1 positive effect. He stands away from the 'prayer' circle after his football games and practices and several of the other players have told him they respect his honesty. He has made some very good friends through sports. As to my former 'friends', I have tried to get them to discuss this civilly - to no avail. I have moved on from them and know who my real friends are.
    *zip*

  2. #22
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    Re: The most hated minority?

    Wow so pikatore wasnt kidding when he said we were going to get flooded by atheists.

    As we already had a massive atheist majority before all of these new people, should somebody put something on a Christian site to balance it out?
    "I think when the history of this period is written, people will realize a lot of the decisions that were made on Wall Street took place over a decade or so, before I arrived in President, during I arrived in President."
    Dubya

  3. #23
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    Re: The most hated minority?

    Just for the record, that one person that WhoAmI keeps alluding to (I counted 3 times) as someone hateful and condescending towards Christians would be myself.
    "What's so wrong about mentioning how attractive she is? That said, i don't think "Begin East Euro Fap" is an appropriate way to say shes attractive."

  4. #24
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    Re: The most hated minority?

    Wow - I didn't mean to flood you guys out

    This site was recommended as one where you could engage in civil debate without too many flame wars. By all means - get more theists of any religion!
    *zip*

  5. #25
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    Re: The most hated minority?

    Quote Originally Posted by pikatore View Post
    Just for the record, that one person that WhoAmI keeps alluding to (I counted 3 times) as someone hateful and condescending towards Christians would be myself.
    I will neither confirm nor deny this claim.

    If you provide the link, in PM of course, Pika, I will go to that site and recruit them here.

  6. #26
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    Re: The most hated minority?

    Quote Originally Posted by cdubs View Post
    As we already had a massive atheist majority before all of these new people, should somebody put something on a Christian site to balance it out?
    Yes! Absolutely! We need more Christians on ODN. It's becoming an atheist community. It wasn't designed to be that. And it also doesn't help because it makes most religious debates impossible to pursue as the Christians (understandably) find themselves swamped.

    Is there any way you could help?
    "I am against religion because it teaches us to be satisfied with not understanding the world" - Richard Dawkins

    "If you could rationalize with Religious people there would be no more Religious people" -Gregory House

  7. #27
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    Re: The most hated minority?

    Brad, it is sad to read about this, but I assure you that not all Christians are like that.

    I believe that Christians who are like that, might be afraid of being influenced or even persuaded to actually do some critical self investigation into their own religion and beliefs.

    Like Allo pointed out already. Christians should (or is suppose to) even love those who are regarded as their biggest enemies. They are suppose to treat them with dignity and with respect, just like they want to be treated.

    If they react the way they do, they seriously need to reconsider their own positions and you are definitely not at fault for feeling the way you do.
    >>]Aspoestertjie[<<

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  8. #28
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    Re: The most hated minority?

    Yes! Absolutely! We need more Christians on ODN. It's becoming an atheist community. It wasn't designed to be that. And it also doesn't help because it makes most religious debates impossible to pursue as the Christians (understandably) find themselves swamped.

    Is there any way you could help?
    I'm sure I could just post on a random Christian site, but I don't have any personal connections to any communities where intelligent discussion is the norm. ( I actually just got a pretty good laugh out of that last bit)
    "I think when the history of this period is written, people will realize a lot of the decisions that were made on Wall Street took place over a decade or so, before I arrived in President, during I arrived in President."
    Dubya

  9. #29
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    Re: The most hated minority?

    Quote Originally Posted by bradfeaker View Post
    Wow - I didn't mean to flood you guys out

    This site was recommended as one where you could engage in civil debate without too many flame wars. By all means - get more theists of any religion!
    Brad, ODN is a site where civil and intelligent debate is the rule. We are lucky to have Apok as the site owner who works very hard in building this community into a respective one (he is a Christian btw).

    What makes us different is our rules, and I recommend you follow the link in my signature to see exactly why we are such a respected community.

    Quote Originally Posted by Allocutus View Post
    Yes! Absolutely! We need more Christians on ODN. It's becoming an atheist community. It wasn't designed to be that. And it also doesn't help because it makes most religious debates impossible to pursue as the Christians (understandably) find themselves swamped.

    Is there any way you could help?
    Well, it doesn't matter really. There are enough agnostics who can and will come up for both sides, like me.

    But I do agree, I think many Christians do feel a bit swamped...
    >>]Aspoestertjie[<<

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  10. #30
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    Re: The most hated minority?

    Aspoestertjie,

    Brad, ODN is a site where civil and intelligent debate is the rule. We are lucky to have Apok as the site owner who works very hard in building this community into a respective one (he is a Christian btw).

    What makes us different is our rules, and I recommend you follow the link in my signature to see exactly why we are such a respected community.

    Thanks - I read the rules before posting anything. If I wanted a flaming battle there are a million other sites for the angry. I really prefer civil discourse.
    *zip*

  11. #31
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    Re: The most hated minority?

    Note: Thread moved to the Introduction Forum
    >>]Aspoestertjie[<<

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  12. #32
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    Re: The most hated minority?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aspoestertjie View Post
    Well, it doesn't matter really. There are enough agnostics who can and will come up for both sides, like me.

    But I do agree, I think many Christians do feel a bit swamped...
    Hey, what classifies you as an agnostic? In other words, what does "agnostic" mean when you say you're an agnostic?

    As for coming up for both sides, agnostics (whatever they are they're not theists) can't possibly support a theist argument; all they can do is question the validity of an atheist argument. But atheists can question such validity too, if the argument isn't coherent.
    "I am against religion because it teaches us to be satisfied with not understanding the world" - Richard Dawkins

    "If you could rationalize with Religious people there would be no more Religious people" -Gregory House

  13. #33
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    Re: The most hated minority?

    Quote Originally Posted by Allocutus View Post
    Hey, what classifies you as an agnostic? In other words, what does "agnostic" mean when you say you're an agnostic?

    As for coming up for both sides, agnostics (whatever they are they're not theists) can't possibly support a theist argument; all they can do is question the validity of an atheist argument. But atheists can question such validity too, if the argument isn't coherent.
    I believe that a deity like God is unknown and the existence of such deity can not be proven or disproven. So I take in the position of 'unknown', if that makes any sense to you.

    Someone discribed themselves as being an Agnostic Theist. I will tend to lean more towards the side of Theists than Agnostics, just for the sake of the argument.

    Of course I can come up for Theists. I have been one my whole life.
    >>]Aspoestertjie[<<

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  14. #34
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    Re: The most hated minority?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aspoestertjie View Post
    I believe that a deity like God is unknown and the existence of such deity can not be proven or disproven. So I take in the position of 'unknown', if that makes any sense to you.
    Yes, it makes sense.

    Of course I can come up for Theists. I have been one my whole life.
    Well, yes you can. I withdraw what I said. You can argue any position, no matter what you believe.

    But as an agnostic, you couldn't support a theist argument (other than to attack an incoherent atheist argument) and be consistent with your own belief.
    "I am against religion because it teaches us to be satisfied with not understanding the world" - Richard Dawkins

    "If you could rationalize with Religious people there would be no more Religious people" -Gregory House

  15. #35
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    Re: The most hated minority?

    Quote Originally Posted by Allocutus View Post
    Yes, it makes sense.



    Well, yes you can. I withdraw what I said. You can argue any position, no matter what you believe.

    But as an agnostic, you couldn't support a theist argument (other than to attack an incoherent atheist argument) and be consistent with your own belief.
    Of course I can. You call it Devil's Advocate.
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  16. #36
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    Re: The most hated minority?

    I believe that a deity like God is unknown and the existence of such deity can not be proven or disproven. So I take in the position of 'unknown', if that makes any sense to you.
    To me the term agnostic is a statement of knowledge, while the terms theist and atheist are statements of belief. I guess that makes me an agnostic atheist
    Last edited by bradfeaker; September 4th, 2009 at 11:24 AM. Reason: grammer/spelling - oops..
    *zip*

  17. #37
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    Re: The most hated minority?

    I married into a heavily catholic family. In fact it was my wife's uncle who was the priest that married us. Her cousin is now a priest. Her mother is a retired hospice nurse and she has a sister that was a nun for sometime.
    Of course I went into the church to marry her, heck I would have crawled over a path of hot coals if that is what she needed me to do to win her hand.

    We were married a year before my religious beliefs were ever even asked about.
    I was straightforward with them. My wife's mother prays for me. But NONE of them snub me.
    I am the only atheist in my family save for my son and daughter. They linger between the lines of "I don't even care if there is a god or not" to "I'm an agnostic".
    No one in my family dogs me over it. Both families see the good work that I have done and still do for my family and community. (actually now 2 communities)
    I DO NOT debate anyone in either family about religion. The only time I did it was with my wife's uncle who had since retired. We discussed and debated for 8 hours with neither of us ever upset.

    Now take a look at me (that's me in my avatar) in my CP. I have very long hair and 6 tattoo's. Not many of my clients seem bothered by that and I teach from a small town FULL of churches.
    However, I found out the hard way that if I want to do what I do I had best avoid ALL talk about religion or (except rarely) politics) I simply say I don't discuss religion or politics with my students or their parents. I don't socialize with any of my students or their parents. Though I do it partially to avoid any propbing questions I (actually both my wife and I) I also have found that if I do so then there seem to be a few parents upset that I didn't invite them.
    So the latter is convienant fore the former.

    However I socialize a lot with both sides of my family. Though there has been some friction over the years I am fully accepted, warts and all......My lifelong friends quit ribbing me about it years ago.
    Last edited by CC; September 4th, 2009 at 03:07 PM.
    When the power of love becomes stronger than the love of power, there will be peace..........jimi hendrix.

  18. #38
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    Re: The most hated minority?

    Welcome to ODN.

    Quote Originally Posted by bradfeaker View Post
    And religious discrimination in employment is a violation of my civil rights.
    Employers in the U.S. may not discriminate based on religious affiliation. Please support your contention that non-affiliation is also protected. Or are you claiming that atheism itself is a religion?
    "If we lose freedom here, there is no place to escape to. This is the last stand on Earth." - Ronald Reagan

  19. #39
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    Re: The most hated minority?

    evensaul,

    Employers in the U.S. may not discriminate based on religious affiliation. Please support your contention that non-affiliation is also protected. Or are you claiming that atheism itself is a religion?

    From section 12-1 of the EEOC compliance manual concerning Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964

    Title VII prohibits covered employers, employment agencies, and unions[16] from:

    1. (1) treating applicants or employees differently (disparate treatment) based on their religious beliefs or practices – or lack thereof – in any aspect of employment, including recruitment, hiring, assignments, discipline, promotion, and benefits

    Source
    *zip*

  20. #40
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    Re: The most hated minority?

    “No, I don't know that atheists should be considered as citizens, nor should they be considered as patriots. This is one nation under God.”

    A quote by George Bush When as wether Atheists should be considered citizens. The President of a SECULAR country is even discriminatory to atheists.
    Isn’t it enough to see that a garden is beautiful without having to believe that there are fairies at the bottom of it too? – Douglas Adams

 

 
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