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  1. #101
    Banned Indefinitely

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    Jul 2010
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    Re: What is Marxism / socialism / communism?

    Ok, lets take a look at the actual facts.

    There has never been a communist country, I have explained that.

    There have been deformed workers states, run by totalitarian bureaucratic regimes.

    The closest to socialism was the first few years in Russia, when the Bolsheviks led the country.

    What was their slogan?


    Yeah, their disregard for human life was so great, that was their slogan. They pulled Russia out of the first world war, thus helping to end it.

    Did they persecute religions?

    Absolutely not. Check the facts. They did disestablish the Orthodox church of course, and take some of its wealth off it, nothing wrong with that. But thats about it. The Orthodox church did side with the counter revolution in a civil war.

    The Jews and Muslims were far better off under the Bolshevik regime.

    The was one instance where loads of people joined some religious sect which was opposed to fighting in order to have an excuse not to go to the front, but Trotsky said thats ok.

    The Orthodox church was counter revolutionary, on the side of the Tsar and the Whites. It owned millions of acres of land and had an annual income of millions of Rubles. It was a willing tool of Tsarism.

    The Bolsheviks did not expect religious beliefs to just disappear overnight.

    Lenin, 1905
    "Religion must be declared a private affair. In these words socialists usually express their attitude towards religion. But the meaning of these words should be accurately defined to prevent any misunderstanding. We demand that religion be held a private affair so far as the state is concerned. But by no means can we consider religion a private affair so far as our Party is concerned. Religion must be of no concern to the state, and religious societies must have no connection with governmental authority. Everyone must be absolutely free to profess any religion he pleases, or no religion whatever, i.e., to be an atheist, which every socialist is, as a rule. Discrimination among citizens on account of their religious convictions is wholly intolerable. Even the bare mention of a citizenís religion in official documents should unquestionably be eliminated."

    Lenin 1909

    "We must not only admit workers who preserve their belief in God into the Social-Democratic Party, but must deliberately set out to recruit them; we are absolutely opposed to giving the slightest offence to their religious convictions..."


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