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  1. #41
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    Re: The "Right" to Secede from a State?

    I hate to play antagonist to all parties in the thread but.

    Quote Originally Posted by SOMEGUY
    As far as I know, it is quite illegal to sign binding contracts to a third party without their permission. Granted, Im not a lawyer, so I could be wrong there.
    I think marriage does that in regards to kids.
    To serve man.

  2. #42
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    Re: The "Right" to Secede from a State?

    Quote Originally Posted by MindTrap028 View Post
    I would have to think that there was no obligation, and there was no contract. Which means there can be non between stats and the fed. (That rests on what we agree on so far).
    Let me first offer a point of clarification, there isn't a contract between the states and the Federal Government, but between the states themselves. The Federal government is the result of the agreement, not a party to it.


    Quote Originally Posted by Someguy View Post
    Well of course, silly =p But, it is still people making contracts with other people. Honda doesnt make contracts with Joe Doe the car buyer.
    Can you support this? If you look at the terms of purchase for vehicles it will be Honda and Joe Doe.


    Quote Originally Posted by Somebody
    Noone has made a contract between me and the state. I never signed anything. Representatives shouldnt be able to sign me to a life contract either without my consent. As far as I know, it is quite illegal to sign binding contracts to a third party without their permission. Granted, Im not a lawyer, so I could be wrong there.
    Hence the moral questionableness of the state right? In social contract theory your existence as a citizen acts as your acceptance of the contract. I would suppose most would argue that your acceptance of legal, police of military protection which you enjoy the fruits of would count as acceptance of the contract (contracts don't need to be signed to be valid).

    Quote Originally Posted by Someone
    Secondly, I do not think it is legal/moral/ethical/right to establish Terms and Conditions for basic God-given rights that bind one to a federal government. For example, saying that in order to breathe air in this part of the world, you are agreeing to ....etc etc etc.
    I'm not sure the Constitution is doing this, could you point out an example of where you would lose your inalienable right if you didn't do something the State required?
    "Suffering lies not with inequality, but with dependence." -Voltaire
    "Fallacies do not cease to be fallacies because they become fashions. -G.K. Chesterton
    Also, if you think I've overlooked your post please shoot me a PM, I'm not intentionally ignoring you.


  3. #43
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    Re: The "Right" to Secede from a State?

    Quote Originally Posted by MindTrap028 View Post
    Without some valid form of enforcment of a contract, in what way is it a contract at all?

    If I sign a paper with you saying "I am obligated to pay squatch $1"..
    But there is no way to validly force me to give you the dollar should I change my mind. Then in what way am I "obligated"? And in what sense is there a "contract"?
    I am suggesting with my first point: "- It is not legal/ethical/moral to enter into a contract that binds a third party to its terms against their will. I know that I never entered into a contact that mandated that I must remain apart of the USA to stay in Florida. So, if a third person has agreed to this, it should not mandate and force me to abide by it."

    That it is even worst than you are presenting here. Its not : If I sign a paper with you saying "I am obligated to pay squatch $1".. no, its more like : " If I sign a piece of paper with you saying " By my signing (MT), Someguy is obligated to pay Squatch $1. "
    I will no longer be replying to any post from a Liberal going forward. I will continue, as normal, to discuss topics and engage in intellectual exchanges with non-leftist

 

 
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