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Poll: would you vote yes to world government

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  1. #1
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    world government

    would you vote for a world government , simply by saying yes?
    I would imagine this government would have a left and right wing to enable debate.
    I would like to put this poll to as many people as possible, any suggestions?

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by byrd5d View Post
    would you vote for a world government , simply by saying yes?
    I would imagine this government would have a left and right wing to enable debate.
    I would like to put this poll to as many people as possible, any suggestions?
    I can't answer until I know what powers the world government has. Assuming the powers make sense I vote yes.

    Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk 2

  3. #3
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    Re: world government

    I vote HELL F*CKEN NO WAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    I would go to war to stop such a government from being formed.

    Power corrupts and this government would be more corrupt than any in history. At least now if you don't like the way a country is being run you can go to another one. But with a world government, if you don't like the laws well you can go to jail or kill yourself.
    abc

  4. #4
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    Re: world government

    Quote Originally Posted by MyXenocide View Post
    Power corrupts and this government would be more corrupt than any in history.
    Power doesn't corrupt; it simply enables people to express outwardly the corruption that already existed in them. An evil person who lacks power might live an outwardly good life because he fears the consequences of acting on his evil desires.

    However I agree that because people are basically evil a world government would be a bad idea.
    The brutal, soul-shaking truth is that we are so earthly minded we are of no heavenly use.
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  6. #5
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    Re: world government

    Quote Originally Posted by theophilus View Post
    Power doesn't corrupt; it simply enables people to express outwardly the corruption that already existed in them. An evil person who lacks power might live an outwardly good life because he fears the consequences of acting on his evil desires.

    However I agree that because people are basically evil a world government would be a bad idea.
    I agree with this but it is irrelevant.

    Power doesn't corrupt, the corrupt seek power. A person who craves power will go into a job that will give them power. Just like a person who craves helping people and danger will become a fire fighter. People who just want power should never be elected as the leader of a country. They will not care about the people they are leading but only about getting more power.

    It is irrelevant because only a person who really wants power will have the motivation to become the leader of the entire world.
    abc

  7. #6
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    Re: world government

    Power attracts the corruptible. The corrupt degrade the corruptible, and so the cycle of the abuse of power continues.

    A world government run by human beings would inevitably lead to a Draconian tyranny, as people in countries like China and India whose populations vastly outweigh smaller nations stripped resources, goods, labor, energy, and other things from the places that produced them without any concern for the welfare of those places.

    There are too many cultures in the world with too many disparate belief systems to make a unified world government a feasible and good idea. There are too many inherent conflicts of interest between different factions of government.
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  8. #7
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    Re: world government

    Under no circumstances would I vote for, accept, or allow an one world government for reasons previous cited and countless others.
    I will no longer be replying to any post from a Liberal going forward. I will continue, as normal, to discuss topics and engage in intellectual exchanges with non-leftist

  9. #8
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    Re: world government

    Quote Originally Posted by theophilus View Post
    However I agree that because people are basically evil a world government would be a bad idea.
    That's a pretty bold and generalized statement against the population of the planet. I'm not going to ask you to support it, because I don't think you can, but you might consider asking yourself what reasoning you have to make such a generalized assumption.
    "The universe is immaterial-mental and spiritual.” --"The Mental Universe” | Nature
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  10. #9
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    Re: world government

    Too vague a question.

    I would vote to be a part of a world coalition that had some government properties. We have some of those already of course so its not a new idea. The notion we'd have a world government with some leaders that have fiat power over all other nations which essentially dissolve their laws etc... no, I would not support that.

    I support world wide human rights, such as the right for a free press, and the right for political speech and assembly and so forth. I'd like to see a slow movement towards unified criminal law for some basic crimes such as murder, assault, and theft, basically building common human standards for civility and fair trade.

    I also think there is some good reason to have a world wide security force, though it would need to build more trust first. The idea would be it would deter war between members states by pledging its support against aggressor nations or those that enslave their citizens.

    I don't want to see a monolith top down government that makes all decisions for the world. Its just too big for that. In fact I think some of the existing states are likely too large for their own good.

    So I'm for naturally moving in that direction rather than trying to force the issue and I think we need an idea of government that at the top sets certain standards and principles but relies more on differentiated implementation at the local level.
    Feed me some debate pellets!

  11. #10
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    Re: world government

    Quote Originally Posted by eye4magic View Post
    Originally Posted by theophilus However I agree that because people are basically evil a world government would be a bad idea.
    That's a pretty bold and generalized statement against the population of the planet. I'm not going to ask you to support it, because I don't think you can, but you might consider asking yourself what reasoning you have to make such a generalized assumption.
    I see plenty of evidence that people are basically evil. One piece of evidence is the fact that I often find myself tempted to do things that are wrong and I have reason to believe that this is true of everyone else. Doesn't the fact that temptation takes place show that everyone has something within him that finds evil attractive? We don't usually give in to temptation because we have learned that it is wrong and the consequences can be bad but this is something we have learned, not something that is part of our nature. Children have to be taught to behave the way they should but know how to do wrong without anyone teaching them.
    The brutal, soul-shaking truth is that we are so earthly minded we are of no heavenly use.
    Leonard Ravenhill

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  12. #11
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    Re: world government

    Quote Originally Posted by theophilus View Post
    I see plenty of evidence that people are basically evil. One piece of evidence is the fact that I often find myself tempted to do things that are wrong and I have reason to believe that this is true of everyone else. Doesn't the fact that temptation takes place show that everyone has something within him that finds evil attractive? We don't usually give in to temptation because we have learned that it is wrong and the consequences can be bad but this is something we have learned, not something that is part of our nature. Children have to be taught to behave the way they should but know how to do wrong without anyone teaching them.
    I see plenty of evidence that people are good. Such as when one person is willing to die in place of another out of love. Or when a parent would rather die than see harm come to their children. Or when a complete stranger runs towards a fire and potential explosion to safe a child that he has never met. You might be inherently evil, Im not...and there are a hell of a lot of people who arent either. Keep your broad sweeping generalizations to yourself.
    I will no longer be replying to any post from a Liberal going forward. I will continue, as normal, to discuss topics and engage in intellectual exchanges with non-leftist

  13. #12
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    Re: world government

    Quote Originally Posted by byrd5d View Post
    would you vote for a world government , simply by saying yes?
    I would imagine this government would have a left and right wing to enable debate.
    I would like to put this poll to as many people as possible, any suggestions?
    No, I wouldn't. Further, such a government is prohibited by the U.S. Constitution.

  14. #13
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    Re: world government

    What about a world government run by an AI? Would anyone support that? We could design this leader to be 'perfect' based on good leaders of the past. For example, this AI would be programmed with the capacity to love but not with the capacity to feel greed. Assuming of course that such a thing will be possible in the future.
    abc

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    Re: world government

    Quote Originally Posted by theophilus View Post
    I see plenty of evidence that people are basically evil. One piece of evidence is the fact that I often find myself tempted to do things that are wrong and I have reason to believe that this is true of everyone else. Doesn't the fact that temptation takes place show that everyone has something within him that finds evil attractive?
    Well, what you seem to be doing here is equating man's vulnerability to temptation to = evilness . Why are they equal?

    We don't usually give in to temptation because we have learned that it is wrong and the consequences can be bad but this is something we have learned, not something that is part of our nature.
    Here is where the difference may be between a truly evil person, at least in my opinion. The very fact that most humans have a conscience and can be taught, that allows us to be aware of temptation and reject it and/or give in to it, verses the person who has no conscience what so ever, no sense of empathy, no sense of temptation, no sense of right or wrong -- these types of people (sometimes refered to as psychotics), I would classify as evil. And, yes, hopefully we should try to keep them out of government and leadership positions.

    However, I think there are probably very few truly evil people on the planet (compared to the overall population) at any given time. What seems to guide most people is their conscience. The fact that we give in to temptation does not make a person fundamentally evil -- maybe temporarily ignorant, dense and week minded or the like.
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  16. #15
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    Re: world government

    Many of you are assuming that a world government would be as centralized and authoritative (not in terms of political system but in terms of power structure) as modern states. Granted, one problem is that the OP is vague and doesn't provide a workable definition of "world government." But such a government could be just as decentralized as federations.

    Let's imagine a world body (the International Union of States) that includes all nation-states who give up part of their sovereignty in return for universal cooperation, security and prosperity. Political, economic and judicial institutions are created in order to set trade policy and resolve disputes among the states. Enforcement of policies and laws passed by the individual nation-states would be binding on each state, and each state would be required to enforce such action themselves (those states that did not vote in favour of said law or policy and simultaneously chose not to enforce it would be punished). An international police force would be set up to ensure peace and order, with each state providing a set number of enforcers in proportion to their population. An international body (the Nuclear Disarmament Agency) would be instituted for the sole purpose of dismantling the nuclear arsenal of all nuclear-armed states to preserve peace and prevent mass destruction. Because each state is also linked to one another through the world economy with a common currency, war would be unthinkable because of its economic consequences and the disruption of universal security which all nation-states enjoy. Now obviously, this can be more detailed, but based on the above, would this not constitute a (decentralized) world government, something similar to a larger, universal version of the European Union?

    If you haven't already noticed, this is not that far off from what we already have. We have a body of world governments (United Nations), an institution that resolves disputes (ICJ, which is connected to the UN, and the ICC which is independent), an organization that sets trade policy (World Trade Organization), a voluntary police force (the UN Police), and a body of international laws (contained in various international statutes, treaties, and conventions). The difference is that power is disproportionately centred around certain states, the burden of enforcing international law is left to the more powerful states, and most of the aforementioned institutions are voluntary.

    One thing is clear: we are moving toward an increasingly globalized world where economic policy is becoming more integrated, and mutual cooperation among nation-states is becoming the norm. The world would not be ready for a world government, but short of the doomsday scenarios, conspiracy theories and the tin foil hats, a decentralized world government is not as radical an idea as what we already have in place. While I still value the principle of state sovereignty, one cannot overlook the way in which our world is constantly changing and moving toward a more integrated world system.
    "Those who would give up ESSENTIAL LIBERTY to purchase a little TEMPORARY SAFETY deserve neither LIBERTY nor SAFETY."--Pennsylvania Assembly

  17. #16
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    Re: world government

    I vote yes.

    I also wonder how many people have tried to leave the country which they were born for a better place - easier said than done.
    Every immigrant wants that, and most every nation hates that.

    I wonder how many of the 'no' people live in countries where there is actual civil debates. I would bet that those used to informed conversations, without demonisations and hyper-rhetoric, would be much more open to the possibility, and have faith in mankind to accomplish such an undertaking. Where education is lacking, anti-intellectualism is rampid, violence is regular, news is purposely misguiding and facts are a rareity, I would imagine that the ability to imagine something really different is uncomprehendable.

    Many are taught to believe in the ability to change everything, but the power structures which rule them!

  18. #17
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    Re: world government

    Quote Originally Posted by KevinBrowning View Post
    No, I wouldn't. Further, such a government is prohibited by the U.S. Constitution.
    The fact that such a government is prohibited by the U.S. Constitution is irrelevant. If a one-world government was created, the Constitution would no longer be a valid document because there would no longer be an American government to protect it.
    ~Zealous

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    Re: world government

    Quote Originally Posted by ZealousDemon View Post
    The fact that such a government is prohibited by the U.S. Constitution is irrelevant. If a one-world government was created, the Constitution would no longer be a valid document because there would no longer be an American government to protect it.
    Negative Ghost Rider. The U.S. Constitution is the "supreme law of the land" there is no external forces, groups, ideas, concepts, governments, or anything else that supersede it. Now, if the Constitution was, through Constitutionally permissible means, dismantled, well, that would be another story. However, even if every other government on earth got together for declared the world under one government, it would not make the slightest bit of difference to Americans. We would not be subjected to it.
    I will no longer be replying to any post from a Liberal going forward. I will continue, as normal, to discuss topics and engage in intellectual exchanges with non-leftist

  20. #19
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    Re: world government

    Quote Originally Posted by Someguy View Post
    Negative Ghost Rider. The U.S. Constitution is the "supreme law of the land" there is no external forces, groups, ideas, concepts, governments, or anything else that supersede it.
    Yes there is. The consensus of the American people supercedes it. The American people can choose to abolish the Constitution if they so wish. It's right there in the preamble. "We the people"... "ordain and establish this Consitution". We have the power to amend the document as we see fit. We can also dismantle it if we want. America follows the Constitution only because we choose to follow it.

    However, even if every other government on earth got together for declared the world under one government, it would not make the slightest bit of difference to Americans. We would not be subjected to it.
    If every other government on earth got together and formed a government, by definition, it would not be a one world government. Namely because there would be two governments. The American government, and the government formed by the rest of the world.

    If the consensus of the American people voted to be included in this one world government, they would be voluntarily surrendering the sovereignty of the United States and abandoning the Constitution.
    ~Zealous

  21. #20
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    Re: world government

    The Constitution is not altered by consensus of the people alone. There is quite a few steps necessary. The only way America and Americans would be under any sort of one world government is if the Constitution was changed to allow it...which of course should be obvious and was implied. Short of that, there is no way a singular world government in which America was apart of could exist.

    Quote Originally Posted by ZealousDemon View Post
    Yes there is. The consensus of the American people supercedes it. The American people can choose to abolish the Constitution if they so wish. It's right there in the preamble. "We the people"... "ordain and establish this Consitution". We have the power to amend the document as we see fit. We can also dismantle it if we want. America follows the Constitution only because we choose to follow it.
    That's not correct.

    To Ratify Amendments [1]

    Three-fourths of the state legislatures approve it, or
    Ratifying conventions in three-fourths of the states approve it. This method has been used only once -- to ratify the 21st Amendment -- repealing Prohibition.
    The Supreme Court has stated that ratification must be within "some reasonable time after the proposal." Beginning with the 18th amendment, it has been customary for Congress to set a definite period for ratification. In the case of the 18th, 20th, 21st, and 22nd amendments, the period set was 7 years, but there has been no determination as to just how long a "reasonable time" might extend.

    Of the thousands of proposals that have been made to amend the Constitution, only 33 obtained the necessary two-thirds vote in Congress. Of those 33, only 27 amendments (including the Bill of Rights) have been ratified.
    -----------
    Here is a cute video if you (like me oftentimes) are too lazy to read it:

    [1] http://usgovinfo.about.com/od/uscons...constamend.htm
    Last edited by Someguy; September 11th, 2012 at 09:11 PM.
    I will no longer be replying to any post from a Liberal going forward. I will continue, as normal, to discuss topics and engage in intellectual exchanges with non-leftist

 

 
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