Welcome guest, is this your first visit? Create Account now to join.
  • Login:

Welcome to the Online Debate Network.

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed.

Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 28
  1. #1
    ODN Community Regular

    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    1,483
    Post Thanks / Like

    There is no racist, like a Liberal racist

    This is a Youtube video from Pat Condell concerning racism that comes from the left.

    I will no longer be replying to any post from a Liberal going forward. I will continue, as normal, to discuss topics and engage in intellectual exchanges with non-leftist

  2. #2
    Registered User

    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    2,765
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: There is no racist, like a Liberal racist

    Isn't this more a video of how the left accuses people of racism rather than the left being racist?

  3. #3
    ODN Community Regular

    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    1,483
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: There is no racist, like a Liberal racist

    It wouldnt be completely inaccurate to describe it as that. And to be fair to the American left, that video refers mainly to the far, far Progressive Liberal left that has infected the UK and much of Europe. I believe that even most American Liberals find much of the far left Progressive movement to be sickening.
    I will no longer be replying to any post from a Liberal going forward. I will continue, as normal, to discuss topics and engage in intellectual exchanges with non-leftist

  4. #4
    Registered User

    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    2,765
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: There is no racist, like a Liberal racist

    Why post it as such then? I don't mind criticism of the left but you need to have something real and properly supported.

    I'm not even really sure he even has a serious point to make since calling anti-Islam racism is just a convenient term. It's still bad no matter what it's called.

  5. #5
    ODN Community Regular

    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    1,483
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: There is no racist, like a Liberal racist

    JJm, you need to take a look at the forums before you start going off at the mouth.

    I post it because its a good vlog entry from someone who makes a lot of sense about problems this world faces.

    Also, because I like the video

    Also, because I can.

    Dont like that? Dont watch / read, champ. Stick to declaring victories in threads where you make yourself look silly rather than actually win anything.
    Last edited by Someguy; January 6th, 2014 at 04:12 PM.
    I will no longer be replying to any post from a Liberal going forward. I will continue, as normal, to discuss topics and engage in intellectual exchanges with non-leftist

  6. #6
    Registered User

    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    2,765
    Post Thanks / Like

    There is no racist, like a Liberal racist

    Quote Originally Posted by Someguy View Post
    JJm, you need to take a look at the forums before you start going off at the mouth.
    I look at everything. This happens to be a low traffic period so all your recent posts stand out a bit as being just a little off the mark in terms of quality posts. I can't knock them all down but some of them are just weird and I'm trying to understand the root of it all.


    I post it because its a good vlog entry from someone who makes a lot of sense about problems this world faces.
    Perhaps, but not this one and certainly not how you are presenting it.

    Also, because I like the video
    Sure, it makes you angry about something. But not anything real though.

    Also, because I can.
    I'm not saying you can't post them. I'm suggesting that you shouldn't. Or at least defend them if you do.

    Dont like that? Dont watch / read, champ. Stick to declaring victories in threads where you make yourself look silly rather than actually win anything.
    Hmm. I thought you'd said that it wasn't a debate so there is nothing to win. Besides, if you had a real point to defend there, you would have done so.

    Here though, you've mismatched the actual point of the video with your title and OP. And I'd like to know why and how that continues to happen.

    Not that I'm claiming any kind of perfection but it's as if you have not watched the video at all.

  7. #7
    ODN Community Regular

    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    1,483
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: There is no racist, like a Liberal racist

    If you view the video, you would see that the title of my thread of the title of the vlog.

    Why shouldn't I post links to videos that I like as long as they are relevant or at the least within the context of the rules? Because it offends you? You have a right to be offended. You do not have a right to silence people or ideas that offend you.

    For example, I find just about everything Progressive Liberalism stands for, supports,.or believes in to be horribly offensive. But, you never hear me say you should not be allowed to post threads or topics on the subject.

    We believe in open dialogue, even about offensive topics as long as they don't violate our community standards. A good example of this is a topic that came up a few years ago about why bestiality should be socially acceptable. While this topic was offensive to nearly everyone, it was allowed to be discussed because it did not violate the rules.

    As far as defending this vlog, there is no need. He does a good job of making his point without my assistance. Additionally, and more specifically, this isn't a debate forum where debate rules apply. Were it so, you would be correct in my needing to make an argument, support, and defend it.

    On a side note, I'm making a re-newed effort to be civil with you and discuss our differences in a calm, rational, respectful manner. I would appreciate you trying, in equal measure, to do the same.

    On another side note, my voice-to-text feature on my phone sucks. :(
    Last edited by Someguy; January 6th, 2014 at 05:38 PM.
    I will no longer be replying to any post from a Liberal going forward. I will continue, as normal, to discuss topics and engage in intellectual exchanges with non-leftist

  8. #8
    ODN Community Regular

    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Seattle, Washington USA
    Posts
    7,468
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: There is no racist, like a Liberal racist

    No one is saying you can't post this Someguy. JJ is simply asking you for your motive, you stated it, all is good.

    Personally, this guy is just ranting, kind of a cheap ploy without any real substance. It smacks of propaganda and ********. Equally as bad in its reasoning as what he accuses others of being.
    Feed me some debate pellets!

  9. #9
    Registered User

    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    2,765
    Post Thanks / Like

    There is no racist, like a Liberal racist

    Quote Originally Posted by Someguy View Post
    If you view the video, you would see that the title of my thread of the title of the vlog.
    I was actually hoping that it was one describing examples of left wing racism but it was of a guy describing how the left mistakenly uses racism to describe Islam and how the accusation is used as a 'weapon'.

    Why shouldn't I post links to videos that I like as long as they are relevant or at the least within the context of the rules? Because it offends you? You have a right to be offended. You do not have a right to silence people or ideas that offend you.
    I'm not offended at all but when you're attempting to demonstrate how terrible the left is then you should be able to do so realistically, and accurately. Otherwise, what's the point?

    There are literally dozens of posts from right wing sites and commentary that are outright racist. Should I post them and argue that all conservatives are racist? That's all you're really doing here.


    For example, I find just about everything Progressive Liberalism stands for, supports,.or believes in to be horribly offensive. Bit, you never hear me say you should not be allowed to post threads our topics on the subject.
    No, but you can and should ensure that everyone is accurate and factual.

    We believe in open dialogue, even about offensive topics ad long as they don't violate our community standards. A good example of this is a topic that came up a few years ago about why bestiality should be socially acceptable. While this topic was offensive to nearly everyone, it was allowed to be discussed because it did not violate the rules.
    Again, I don't find this video or this post offensive. I just don't think either are accurate portrayals of how the left sees race nor how the accusations of such are formulated.

    As far as defending this vlog, there is no need. He does a good job poof making his point without my assistance.
    Yet you posted it and editorialized it for all to see. And to discuss.

    Additionally, and more specifically, this isn't a debate forum where debate apply. Where it so, tippy would be correct in my needing to make an argument, support, and defend it.
    But this is a public forum whether it's for debating or not, there are certainly discussions to be had on it. It's certainly not a general garbage dump for anything that takes anyone's fancy with no follow up. Is it?

    On a side note, I'm making a re-newed effort to be civil with you and discuss our differences in a calm, rational, respectful manner. I would appreciate you trying, in equal measure, to do the same.
    Of course but posts like these are extremely provocative. You do see that don't you? I could easily do a huge post on all racism but largely don't because it achieves little to change the thinking that underlies the actions.

    Also, when your material doesn't line up with the OP, something has to be corrected: either the OP needs to be rewritten or the video replaced. So this isn't personal but I think there should be a little more rigor.

    Anyway, I appropriate the civility and will of course respond in kind.

  10. #10
    ODN Community Regular

    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    1,483
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: There is no racist, like a Liberal racist

    Quote Originally Posted by JimJones8934 View Post

    Anyway, I appropriate the civility and will of course respond in kind.
    I am walking out the door right now, but I think we can begin to establish some common ground based on this.

    I will respond to everything else later on tonight / tomorrow morning.

    Good day
    I will no longer be replying to any post from a Liberal going forward. I will continue, as normal, to discuss topics and engage in intellectual exchanges with non-leftist

  11. #11
    ODN Community Regular

    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    5,626
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: There is no racist, like a Liberal racist

    A few issues:


    1.) I think his critique of cultural relativism as a form of racism might be relevant if it actually were the predominant view of liberals and the Left, but it betrays the fact that firstly he views all non-white views as necessarily inferior (which is exactly what cultural relativism isn't) and thus the world is needs more white people views. Frankly, I'd agree with him if he means science and academic studies, but sadly he mostly means right-wing Enlightenment-era economics and political philosophy.

    2.) Obviously, Pat Condell is exactly the man who I go to when I want to hear about who supports racism and who doesn't. It's not like he supports a far right-wing, nearly openly racist party in the UK. Oh wait, yes he does!

    3.) He's a right-wing hack, so I could give a sod-all about his opinions on racism and how he thinks it applies to the Left-wing. I used to listen to him a little bit back when he mainly talked about religion, but he's such a bloviating jackass, it's really hard to take anything that he says seriously. He's a polemic, and a not-so-intellectual one at that.
    "Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities." --Voltaire

  12. Thanks CowboyX thanked for this post
  13. #12
    ODN Community Regular

    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Seattle, Washington USA
    Posts
    7,468
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: There is no racist, like a Liberal racist

    Quote Originally Posted by GoldPhoenix View Post
    2.) Obviously, Pat Condell is exactly the man who I go to when I want to hear about who supports racism and who doesn't. It's not like he supports a far right-wing, nearly openly racist party in the UK. Oh wait, yes he does!
    Not sure that article paints them as nearly openly racists. They have a forum where some party members said some really nasty things about homosexuals and one comment about Africans that is at least tangentially racist. But the party leadership is espousing directly that they do not tolerate racism and will investigate. I don't think that's too definitive one way or another.

    The one thing they guy in the video says I somewhat agree with is we can devalue the term by using it frivolously or inaccurately. Being against gay relationships is not technically racism since gays are not really a race. Its bigotry, but not racism.

    Is racism worse than bigotry... no i don't think so, just a particular brand.


    (Otherwise I agree with your arguments.)
    Feed me some debate pellets!

  14. #13
    ODN Community Regular

    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    1,483
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: There is no racist, like a Liberal racist

    Quote Originally Posted by Sigfried View Post
    Not sure that article paints them as nearly openly racists. They have a forum where some party members said some really nasty things about homosexuals and one comment about Africans that is at least tangentially racist. But the party leadership is espousing directly that they do not tolerate racism and will investigate. I don't think that's too definitive one way or another.

    The one thing they guy in the video says I somewhat agree with is we can devalue the term by using it frivolously or inaccurately. Being against gay relationships is not technically racism since gays are not really a race. Its bigotry, but not racism.

    Is racism worse than bigotry... no i don't think so, just a particular brand.


    (Otherwise I agree with your arguments.)
    I do not view being against gay relationships as either racist or bigoted. Most people who are against homosexuality are so because they are firmly rooted in their religious beliefs. Nearly every major religion on earth opposes homosexuality. So, are Atheist the only non-bigots in the world?
    I will no longer be replying to any post from a Liberal going forward. I will continue, as normal, to discuss topics and engage in intellectual exchanges with non-leftist

  15. #14
    Registered User

    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    2,765
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: There is no racist, like a Liberal racist

    Quote Originally Posted by Someguy View Post
    I do not view being against gay relationships as either racist or bigoted. Most people who are against homosexuality are so because they are firmly rooted in their religious beliefs. Nearly every major religion on earth opposes homosexuality. So, are Atheist the only non-bigots in the world?
    I'm not sure if this is true in the West where homosexuality is more socially accepted. I think religious people have to agree that its a sin but the more liberal minded ones treat it as one as bad as sexual promiscuity; i.e. it's probably not the best thing to do but there are plenty of worse things and we should really be worrying about those. Secondly, those versed in the Constitution have no choice but to respect the separation of Church & State and recognize that their religious convictions should not be imposed on others who do not share the same belief system.

    However, being against gay relationships is completed bigoted since they are not consistent in being against other sins (if indeed religion and not latent homosexuality is the true source). If people were against sex before marriage, promiscuity, sex for pleasure (as opposed to breeding) as much as they seem to be against gay relationships then I would agree with you, that they are not bigoted. That is not the case, so I think its a fair charge.

  16. #15
    ODN Community Regular

    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    1,483
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: There is no racist, like a Liberal racist

    Quote Originally Posted by JimJones8934 View Post
    I'm not sure if this is true in the West where homosexuality is more socially accepted. I think religious people have to agree that its a sin but the more liberal minded ones treat it as one as bad as sexual promiscuity; i.e. it's probably not the best thing to do but there are plenty of worse things and we should really be worrying about those.
    Certainly it is a sin. I do not, however, agree with the argument that it is a sin of less deviance....or whatever term one might use to assign degrees of sin to certain actions. Speaking from the Christian point of view, all sins can be looked at as equal in some sense in that any sin makes you a sinner and causes you to fall short of the glory of God....in other words, any sin gets you cast into hell.

    I know that there are other religions out there which believe that homosexuality is THE cardinal sin...one in which is so bad that the eternal glory of God is permanently lost forever if one commits such an act. I believe Catholicism has a belief similar to this, and I am sure Islam does.

    So, if the Liberal minded people you speak of are labeling homosexuality as a sin, but just not a really bad one, then they are 1 of 3 things:

    1: Ignorant to the teachings of their religion
    2: Arrogant beyond belief as they think that they have right and wisdom to know better than God...or perhaps they think that they know better than the church...or that they think they know God's real intention.
    3: They follow a different sort of religion all together which exposes such beliefs.

    Now to be sure, I do not concern myself with others belief systems. People are free to believe what they want, of course.

    Quote Originally Posted by JimJones8934 View Post
    Secondly, those versed in the Constitution have no choice but to respect the separation of Church & State and recognize that their religious convictions should not be imposed on others who do not share the same belief system.
    Here we agree completely....well, apart from the "Separation of Church and State" thing as that is not in the Constitution. One of the things I really, really hate about the left and right is that they each believe that they have the moral authority and obligation to impose their moral beliefs onto others at the point of a gun (through the force of the state. i.e. laws)

    Quote Originally Posted by JimJones8934 View Post
    However, being against gay relationships is completed bigoted since they are not consistent in being against other sins (if indeed religion and not latent homosexuality is the true source).
    Here we disagree. I think I laid out my case as to why I disagree in the first answer. Please let me know if you do not think I satisfactorily addressed this point above.

    Quote Originally Posted by JimJones8934 View Post
    If people were against sex before marriage, promiscuity, sex for pleasure (as opposed to breeding) as much as they seem to be against gay relationships then I would agree with you, that they are not bigoted. That is not the case, so I think its a fair charge.
    I would note here that there are several communities that do. Mormons and the Amish come to mind off hand. Also, as I have stated, several other religions teach that homosexuality is THE cardinal sin. In those beliefs systems, homosexuality is the worst sin one can commit, therefore, it is only natural that those people would champion against it much more so than other sins.
    I will no longer be replying to any post from a Liberal going forward. I will continue, as normal, to discuss topics and engage in intellectual exchanges with non-leftist

  17. #16
    Banned Indefinitely

    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Southern California, USA
    Posts
    2,018
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: There is no racist, like a Liberal racist

    Quote Originally Posted by Someguy View Post
    This is a Youtube video from Pat Condell concerning racism that comes from the left.
    And here's an example of the "sophisticated" liberal being racist:



    Followed by the operatic apology I wish I could show you, but for ODN's niggardly (does this word choice amount to "Left-baiting"?) allotment of videos per post.


    The irony gets about neck deep when we learn that almost as soon as Perry stopped sobbing, she sits listening intently to Katrina vanden Heuvel, editor and publisher of The Nation (oldest continuously published magazine in the US, "...currently has over 150,000 subscribers and is the self-described flagship of the Left) stating as fact the Tea Party is a party of racists.

    I've got a pretty good imagination...and I couldn't make this stuff up!

  18. Likes Someguy liked this post
  19. #17
    ODN Community Regular

    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Seattle, Washington USA
    Posts
    7,468
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: There is no racist, like a Liberal racist

    Quote Originally Posted by Someguy View Post
    I do not view being against gay relationships as either racist or bigoted. Most people who are against homosexuality are so because they are firmly rooted in their religious beliefs. Nearly every major religion on earth opposes homosexuality. So, are Atheist the only non-bigots in the world?
    In this respect a qualified yes. Though honestly there are many religions that do not treat homosexuals as immoral. And many more make a reasonable distinction that while a sin, they do not treat people who are homosexual as less human than themselves.

    In my experience you are not bigoted about homosexuality in that while you hold a view it is a sin, you don't discriminate against anyone based on that belief.

    Certainly though some more extreme groups are very much bigots due to or in concert with their religious beliefs.

    ---------- Post added at 12:44 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:37 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by cstamford View Post
    And here's an example of the "sophisticated" liberal being racist:

    I've got a pretty good imagination...and I couldn't make this stuff up!
    That incident is a much better case of someone acting in a shameful and racist manner. Its not discrimination but it is certainly racist in the sense that it makes a show of a racial difference for no good reason but to mock people. It also unfairly denigrates a kind and generous act as a superficial one with no good justification.

    It would only be warranted if Romney had made a big show of the adoption as a demonstration of his color blindness, then there might be cause to question his motives, but otherwise he's just being a good person which doesn't deserve mocking by anyone.
    Feed me some debate pellets!

  20. Likes CowboyX liked this post
  21. #18
    ODN Community Regular

    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    5,626
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: There is no racist, like a Liberal racist

    Quote Originally Posted by Someguy View Post
    I do not view being against gay relationships as either racist or bigoted. Most people who are against homosexuality are so because they are firmly rooted in their religious beliefs. Nearly every major religion on earth opposes homosexuality. So, are Atheist the only non-bigots in the world?
    Yes, as long as someone said it 200 to 5,000 years ago, it must be true. Also, that becomes even more likely true when they tell you that they were following the orders of supernatural forces. =)


    It's amusing that in most major world religions, homosexuality itself is usually not wrong, but sodomy, masturbation, or any non-procreative sex is considered immoral or unethical. I always find it amusing that Christians and other religious fold lambast gays, but behind closed doors they perform the same sexual acts that are equally immoral and unethical in their religious creeds. I wish people would stop believing in nonsense like religion, but a decent start (which is already happening) would be for people to stop pretending like the care about same-sex relations when they do equally immoral things inside their own bedroom. Even better, if people just understood that it's absurd to classify a consensual sexual act as "immoral", then all the better.

    Quote Originally Posted by cstam
    I wish I could show you, but for ODN's niggardly (does this word choice amount to "Left-baiting"?) allotment of videos per post.
    No, it's of Nordic origin, not the similar sounding word of Romantic origin. It does make your word choice overly crass and intentionally childish, however.
    "Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities." --Voltaire

  22. #19
    Banned Indefinitely

    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Southern California, USA
    Posts
    2,018
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: There is no racist, like a Liberal racist

    Quote Originally Posted by GoldPhoenix View Post
    No, it's of Nordic origin, not the similar sounding word of Romantic origin. It does make your word choice overly crass and intentionally childish, however.
    I guess it does.

  23. #20
    ODN Community Regular

    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    1,483
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: There is no racist, like a Liberal racist

    Quote Originally Posted by GoldPhoenix View Post
    Yes, as long as someone said it 200 to 5,000 years ago, it must be true.
    That is a comment that I would have thought beneath you. How do you know that any particular religion is true or not? Have you any conclusive proof to back up this idea that you know better than anyone else? Most of the world's population believed with absolute conviction that the world was flat a 1,000 years ago. What man thinks isn't necessarily true, however, it's pretty juvenile to think that you, as one single man, have the answers to the world...or at least the answers to the questions of whether God exists...especially considering the number of people through out history who believed strongly enough in their God to be willing to die for it. It's pretty insulting to think you are above or more enlightened that a religious person based on the sole fact that you do not believe.

    Quote Originally Posted by GoldPhoenix View Post
    Also, that becomes even more likely true when they tell you that they were following the orders of supernatural forces. =)
    Some people follow the direction and wishes of their God. Others follow the directions and wishes of man as if they are god. Liberals do this quite a bit. I rather be subjected to the will of a God rather than a man wishing he was god.

    Quote Originally Posted by GoldPhoenix View Post
    It's amusing that in most major world religions, homosexuality itself is usually not wrong,
    Actually, homosexuality IS wrong in most of the world's major religions. Please support this claim if you care to make it.

    Quote Originally Posted by GoldPhoenix View Post
    I always find it amusing that Christians and other religious fold lambast gays, but behind closed doors they perform the same sexual acts that are equally immoral and unethical in their religious creeds.
    No one is prefect.

    Quote Originally Posted by GoldPhoenix View Post
    I wish people would stop believing in nonsense like religion,
    We can't all be as enlightened as you are. We aren't gifted with your obvious gift of knowing everything.

    Quote Originally Posted by GoldPhoenix View Post
    but a decent start (which is already happening) would be for people to stop pretending like the care about same-sex relations when they do equally immoral things inside their own bedroom.
    Both are sins. One they are emotionally and physiologically connected to, the other they are not. It's not difficult to see why someone could rally strongly against a sin that they are not partaking in.

    Quote Originally Posted by GoldPhoenix View Post
    Even better, if people just understood that it's absurd to classify a consensual sexual act as "immoral", then all the better.
    Religious folks don't concern themselves with your morality.

    Quote Originally Posted by GoldPhoenix View Post
    No, it's of Nordic origin, not the similar sounding word of Romantic origin. It does make your word choice overly crass and intentionally childish, however.
    Overly crass? Yes. Intentionally childish? No.
    I will no longer be replying to any post from a Liberal going forward. I will continue, as normal, to discuss topics and engage in intellectual exchanges with non-leftist

 

 
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Is this racist?
    By Prime Zombie in forum Social Issues
    Replies: 74
    Last Post: July 29th, 2010, 03:56 PM
  2. I Guess I'm A Racist
    By Loller65 in forum Shootin' the Breeze / Off-Topic
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: December 8th, 2009, 04:53 AM
  3. Eminem is NOT racist.
    By Swindall in forum Shootin' the Breeze / Off-Topic
    Replies: 159
    Last Post: August 14th, 2009, 06:19 PM
  4. Was this racist?
    By cat's meow in forum Current Events
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: September 10th, 2006, 02:04 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •