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Poll: Is world peace achievable?

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  1. #1
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    How long will it take for peace to come to the world?

    Firstly; is world peace achievable? How do we bring peace to the world? How long will it take? Can we give an estimate?

    I think that world peace is definetely achievable as war destroys so many peoples lives; we can't let this go on forever or we'll all be dead. I've always thought that if WW3 ever broke out we would all die, or it would atleast wipe out the majority of us. I realise that facing this argument there is the fact that throughout history we have never had a full day of peace.
    I think that there are many ways to bring peace to the world. They say WW2 was supposed to be the war that ended all wars; I see where they are coming from, but I don't agree. A lot of the time when war ends, the two oppositions hate each other, that isn't peace. I certainly agree that we need to kill the terrorists, because peace will never come if we have the nutbags blowing up public buildings. I suppose the hardest way to bring peace would be to bring children up in the right state of mind, but then I must question whether that would bring peace.
    I don't think we can give a year for world peace; but i do know that it is highly unlikely it will come in my lifetime. I think that it is possible to bring peace to the world very quickly, but the things that it would take are unlikely to happen.

    I'm interested to see what you think, because i know that it is a highly debated topic.

  2. #2
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    Re: How long will it take for peace to come to the world?

    Quote Originally Posted by jbk1203 View Post
    Firstly; is world peace achievable? How do we bring peace to the world? How long will it take? Can we give an estimate?

    I think that world peace is definetely achievable as war destroys so many peoples lives; we can't let this go on forever or we'll all be dead. I've always thought that if WW3 ever broke out we would all die, or it would atleast wipe out the majority of us. I realise that facing this argument there is the fact that throughout history we have never had a full day of peace.
    I think that there are many ways to bring peace to the world. They say WW2 was supposed to be the war that ended all wars; I see where they are coming from, but I don't agree. A lot of the time when war ends, the two oppositions hate each other, that isn't peace. I certainly agree that we need to kill the terrorists, because peace will never come if we have the nutbags blowing up public buildings. I suppose the hardest way to bring peace would be to bring children up in the right state of mind, but then I must question whether that would bring peace.
    I don't think we can give a year for world peace; but i do know that it is highly unlikely it will come in my lifetime. I think that it is possible to bring peace to the world very quickly, but the things that it would take are unlikely to happen.

    I'm interested to see what you think, because i know that it is a highly debated topic.
    I think whirled peas is much more likely than world peace. Have you really "always" thought that the destruction from WWIII would kill us all? How often have you worried over such a war? Do you contemplate the aftermath of world wars often or just future world wars? Actually, the War to End All Wars was attributable to WWI, not WWII.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_war_to_end_war

    So, clearly, they got that one wrong.

    Now, look, if we you are asking whether the day of superpowers directly fighting one another is over, you may be pleasantly surprised. Since WWII, there has not been a war amongst the superpowers (i.e. those that hold nuclear weapons). Will regional wars and civil wars ever end? Well... if we consider history and look at it broadly, then there is reason for actual hope here. After all, it was not uncommon a couple of hundred years ago for wars to break out amongst whomever was the superpower at the time and whoever was jealous of said superpower. With the advent of the nuclear weapon, such wars have really become outdated. Is country A really going to try to rid the world of country B when country B is armed with a nuclear weapon that can wipe out country A? Reason says no. So, when nuclear weapons (or weapons with nuclear like capabilities) become a tool that can be used by very small armies, then we'll see wars reduced amongst all levels of nation-states. Is such technology around the corner? I dunno. Maybe a hundred or a couple of hundred years away. Who knows, the speed that technology seems to increase may mean whirled peas will here sooner rather than later.
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  4. #3
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    Re: How long will it take for peace to come to the world?

    I think its possible and that eventually it will happen, but it isn't going to happen really soon and there is a chance it never will.

    I'm generally an optimist and I think that once you remove the reasons for wars then we likely won't have them. Those reasons tend to be scarcity, greed, extreme ideology, and ignorance.

    Scarcity: Very hard to eliminate this and we have a long long way to go. But I do think technology will let us get close enough to prevent it from causing major wars. (I may be overly optimistic but I've grown up in an age of technology defeating most doom scenarios of the past.)

    Greed: The only good counter here is to have more to loose from war than you can gain, and indeed the way economies are entangling this is becoming more true every day. Superpowers have far more to loose than they are likely to gain from wars. Smaller countries with a lot less to loose stand a lot more to gain. Threats of intervention by major powers however make such gains look very remote much of the time. Kuwait was a lesson for those considering such a move as to what can happen. Reach too far and your hand will be cut off.

    Extreme Ideology: Its still out here but honestly I think it continues to shrink. The uber melting pot of the internet both gives voice to radicals and moderates and the moderate voices are much more numerous (if quieter). While its always making a lot of noise, my view of the last 30 years is a world growing more tolerant, wise, and peaceful overall. Many differences we now take for granted were once seen as unimaginably foreign and exotic.

    Ignorance: We are all born to it and you can't cure it forcibly, but the information needed to cure it is more available than ever.
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    Re: How long will it take for peace to come to the world?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ibelsd View Post
    I think whirled peas is much more likely than world peace. Have you really "always" thought that the destruction from WWIII would kill us all? How often have you worried over such a war? Do you contemplate the aftermath of world wars often or just future world wars? Actually, the War to End All Wars was attributable to WWI, not WWII.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_war_to_end_war

    So, clearly, they got that one wrong.

    Now, look, if we you are asking whether the day of superpowers directly fighting one another is over, you may be pleasantly surprised. Since WWII, there has not been a war amongst the superpowers (i.e. those that hold nuclear weapons). Will regional wars and civil wars ever end? Well... if we consider history and look at it broadly, then there is reason for actual hope here. After all, it was not uncommon a couple of hundred years ago for wars to break out amongst whomever was the superpower at the time and whoever was jealous of said superpower. With the advent of the nuclear weapon, such wars have really become outdated. Is country A really going to try to rid the world of country B when country B is armed with a nuclear weapon that can wipe out country A? Reason says no. So, when nuclear weapons (or weapons with nuclear like capabilities) become a tool that can be used by very small armies, then we'll see wars reduced amongst all levels of nation-states. Is such technology around the corner? I dunno. Maybe a hundred or a couple of hundred years away. Who knows, the speed that technology seems to increase may mean whirled peas will here sooner rather than later.
    WW2 must have been a typo, sorry.

    I've always thought that WW3 would certainly kill the majority of the world, because it is likely that countries would use their nukes in such an event.

  6. #5
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    Re: How long will it take for peace to come to the world?

    I think it is achievable, but I dont think it is until we become a Type 1 civilization at the earliest. I believe that us becoming a type 1 civilization is only a possibility though and not an absolute. It is more likely, in my opinion, that we kill each other off than reach Type 1 status, but then again, Im not an optimist.

    The reason why I look at us becoming Type 1 as a pre-requisite is exactly for the reasons Sig laid out. Particularly the greed and scarcity parts. I dont worry much about extreme ideology or ignorance holding us back. I think that once we solve the scarcity problem that those things will take care of themselves rapidly.
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    Re: How long will it take for peace to come to the world?

    Quote Originally Posted by jbk1203 View Post
    Firstly; is world peace achievable?
    You mean without some fundamental change in human nature? No.

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    Re: How long will it take for peace to come to the world?

    Quote Originally Posted by jbk1203 View Post
    WW2 must have been a typo, sorry.

    I've always thought that WW3 would certainly kill the majority of the world, because it is likely that countries would use their nukes in such an event.
    I should take you for your word, but in context your mistake didn't actually seem to be a typo. I mean you posited that "WWII" was supposed to be the war that ended all wars, but that you didn't agree. If this were a typo, you'd have indicated this was clearly not the case. No need to agree. WWII did, in fact, follow the war to end all wars. Just sayin'. If you make a mistake, just man-up and admit it.

    With that being said, let's work on your actual debating skills. I made an argument to rebut your position. The argument is, essentially, the presence of nukes reduces the threat of war. Countries with nukes simply do not engage in wars with other countries that have nukes. Your response was to repeat yourself. Add some logic to your argument and rebut my points where you find them lacking. Don't just use repetition. Don't be a Sean Hannity.
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    Re: How long will it take for peace to come to the world?

    Quote Originally Posted by jbk1203 View Post
    How do we bring peace to the world?
    I think it starts by asking: Does the world want peace? If the world wants peace, then I should think it would move toward that objective.

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    Re: How long will it take for peace to come to the world?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ibelsd View Post
    The argument is, essentially, the presence of nukes reduces the threat of war. Countries with nukes simply do not engage in wars with other countries that have nukes.
    Well, the US didn't hesitate to invade Iraq on the basis that they had nukes (but they likely knew the truth). Yet during that time, I don't recall anyone being concerned that the US or their military forces were embarking on a suicide mission. It seems that everyone thinking in the shoes of Saddam Hussein, believed he wouldn't launch nukes just because the country was invaded. That makes sense in the case of mutually-assured destruction. Unless you feel your existence is doomed, you are not going to doom your existence by launching nuclear weapons. Another example is militants in the Gaza Strip launching rockets into Israel. If the enemy is a country in close proximity, or engaging in guerrilla warfare, using nukes is not an option.

    However, I do think that the presence of nukes will limit the scale of war. Countries will still have conflicts, but they will tread a lot more carefully. In particular, they will take care to avoid mass civilian casualties and political targets, since their leaders would feel their existence is threatened. The end goal will be to force a settlement similar to the Versailles Treaty, as opposed to overthrowing the government.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sigfried View Post
    Greed: The only good counter here is to have more to loose from war than you can gain, and indeed the way economies are entangling this is becoming more true every day. Superpowers have far more to loose than they are likely to gain from wars. Smaller countries with a lot less to loose stand a lot more to gain. Threats of intervention by major powers however make such gains look very remote much of the time. Kuwait was a lesson for those considering such a move as to what can happen. Reach too far and your hand will be cut off.
    Before 1914 Germany and Britain had become each other’s largest trading partners. http://www.economist.com/news/books-...d473adf5773841
    It was often said that war was unlikely, because national economies were so integrated.

    Certainly, major powers have a lot to gain from invading weaker powers. Alliances such as the UN and NATO do not solve the problem of greed. They just concentrate power, which can then be exercised against the weakest link.

  12. #10
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    Re: How long will it take for peace to come to the world?

    Quote Originally Posted by jbk1203 View Post
    Firstly; is world peace achievable? How do we bring peace to the world? How long will it take? Can we give an estimate?

    I think that world peace is definetely achievable as war destroys so many peoples lives; we can't let this go on forever or we'll all be dead. I've always thought that if WW3 ever broke out we would all die, or it would atleast wipe out the majority of us. I realise that facing this argument there is the fact that throughout history we have never had a full day of peace.
    I think that there are many ways to bring peace to the world. They say WW2 was supposed to be the war that ended all wars; I see where they are coming from, but I don't agree. A lot of the time when war ends, the two oppositions hate each other, that isn't peace. I certainly agree that we need to kill the terrorists, because peace will never come if we have the nutbags blowing up public buildings. I suppose the hardest way to bring peace would be to bring children up in the right state of mind, but then I must question whether that would bring peace.
    I don't think we can give a year for world peace; but i do know that it is highly unlikely it will come in my lifetime. I think that it is possible to bring peace to the world very quickly, but the things that it would take are unlikely to happen.

    I'm interested to see what you think, because i know that it is a highly debated topic.
    I think world peace is a utopian ideal. Like all ideals they are worked toward to better society, they don't always bear fruit for being attainable but for acting as something better to drive people toward in reality.

    In the case of wwii being the war to end all wars is more about how one evil could have been eradicated by another evil to bring forth peace afterward, no greater or similar world war has developed to my knowledge and therefore the parties chasing after the ideal were successful in creating something to drive people toward something better in the reality in which they love. Then again, considering the standing modern society with the gang rape cases, privacy issues due to the internet, wars like the war on terror (where there aren't two definite parties at war, and no one knows who to support without intense debate), you know that the acclaimed 'peace' is still a utopian ideal that is being worked toward except now it is different - with a lot of people getting onto facebook all around the world to stay connected, they are trying to bring that utopian ideal to reality, but still good things are happening along the way.

    Then there is also the question of whether or not the utopian ideal against terror now, etc is truly utopian, - what if future events change the course of humanity like World War II did and we develop a new utopian ideal just as what happened after World War II up until now.

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    Re: How long will it take for peace to come to the world?

    Firstly for your first paragraph; i have no wish to debate whether i made a mistake or not, i have my opinion and you have yours which i respect. Now i look back on my reply i realise that i have indeed just repeated myself. I do agree that the threat of WW3 is surpressed by the exhistance of nuclear weapons, but i am saying that if for some reason that WW3 did break out for another reason and countries were willing to use nuclear weapons, it would kill most of the human race.

    ---------- Post added at 03:53 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:48 PM ----------

    I think that most of the world does want peace; however i think that we are not doing enough to stop the nutbags that blow up towers and subways etc.

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    Re: How long will it take for peace to come to the world?

    Quote Originally Posted by Quicky View Post
    Well, the US didn't hesitate to invade Iraq on the basis that they had nukes (but they likely knew the truth). Yet during that time, I don't recall anyone being concerned that the US or their military forces were embarking on a suicide mission. It seems that everyone thinking in the shoes of Saddam Hussein, believed he wouldn't launch nukes just because the country was invaded. That makes sense in the case of mutually-assured destruction. Unless you feel your existence is doomed, you are not going to doom your existence by launching nuclear weapons. Another example is militants in the Gaza Strip launching rockets into Israel. If the enemy is a country in close proximity, or engaging in guerrilla warfare, using nukes is not an option.
    This is a good point. I should restate. We would not invade a country that has nukes AND that could use them to attack the U.S. We believed Iraq had nukes. We did not believe it had the capability to use them against us. Iraq was not suspected of having ICBM's. This is why we are not invading N. Korea. We believe if we attacked N. Korea, nukes would be used effectively against the South. As it relates to civil wars and small-scale conflicts, my argument was that peace would expand as technology allowed it. I fully recognized that nuclear capabilities would not, as they exist today, end small-scale conflicts.

    Quote Originally Posted by Quicky View Post
    However, I do think that the presence of nukes will limit the scale of war. Countries will still have conflicts, but they will tread a lot more carefully. In particular, they will take care to avoid mass civilian casualties and political targets, since their leaders would feel their existence is threatened. The end goal will be to force a settlement similar to the Versailles Treaty, as opposed to overthrowing the government.
    Similar to the Versailles Treaty? You mean the treaty that left Germany's military fuming and is generally considered one of the reasons why the Germans embraced Nazi ideology? I don't think states would let themselves get abused like that if they possessed their own nuclear stockpiles.

    ---------- Post added at 12:15 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:13 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by jbk1203 View Post
    Now i look back on my reply i realise that i have indeed just repeated myself. I do agree that the threat of WW3 is surpressed by the exhistance of nuclear weapons, but i am saying that if for some reason that WW3 did break out for another reason and countries were willing to use nuclear weapons, it would kill most of the human race.
    I guess. The point, though, is that nuclear weapons generally enhance the prospects of peace. WWIII seems highly unlikely as more countries become armed with bigger and bigger weapons.
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    Re: How long will it take for peace to come to the world?

    Quote Originally Posted by jbk1203 View Post
    [/COLOR]I think that most of the world does want peace; however i think that we are not doing enough to stop the nutbags that blow up towers and subways etc.
    Maybe that’s part of the problem. Maybe we shouldn’t assume that it’s just about doing more or not enough to stop nutbags that blow up towers and subways. Perhaps there’s more to the equation for world peace.

    Consider a smaller unit, i.e., a family or small community. If most of the members in a community are not peaceful, balanced, loving, functional, morally driven people, but instead, they are hateful, unpeaceful, contentious, unbalanced and generally immoral, it stands to reason that the family or community will reflect what its members have become regardless of what they may do to create a peaceful community.

    We can do all kinds of things to create a peaceful community, but if we’re not living the principles of what our doing is attempting to create, the doing itself is only part of equation.

    So there’s probably something relevant to the old axiom, ’be the change you want to see in the world.”
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    Re: How long will it take for peace to come to the world?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ibelsd View Post
    Similar to the Versailles Treaty? You mean the treaty that left Germany's military fuming and is generally considered one of the reasons why the Germans embraced Nazi ideology? I don't think states would let themselves get abused like that if they possessed their own nuclear stockpiles.
    By the 1940s, poison gases had been developed like other technologies to become a lot more effective than they were in WW1. Consider that Hitler never used poison gas against enemy soldiers or in bombing cities, and neither did the Allies. Both sides would have had stockpiles of poison gas ready in case the other side used them. Yet throughout the entire war, the fear of retaliation was strong enough to discipline either side. I think this reasoning will apply to what we call WMDs today.
    http://www.historylearningsite.co.uk...ld_war_two.htm

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    Re: How long will it take for peace to come to the world?

    Quote Originally Posted by Quicky View Post
    By the 1940s, poison gases had been developed like other technologies to become a lot more effective than they were in WW1. Consider that Hitler never used poison gas against enemy soldiers or in bombing cities, and neither did the Allies. Both sides would have had stockpiles of poison gas ready in case the other side used them. Yet throughout the entire war, the fear of retaliation was strong enough to discipline either side. I think this reasoning will apply to what we call WMDs today.
    http://www.historylearningsite.co.uk...ld_war_two.htm
    You have me confused as to what point you are trying to make. What does the Versailles treaty have to do with the Nazi's non-use of chemical agents.
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    Re: How long will it take for peace to come to the world?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ibelsd View Post
    You have me confused as to what point you are trying to make. What does the Versailles treaty have to do with the Nazi's non-use of chemical agents.
    Forget the Versailles Treaty. Think of Stalin sitting in his bunker, tearing his moustache out over the advancing German troops. No poison gas was used to stop them. Think of Hitler sitting his bunker from 1943 onwards, tearing his moustache out over the failure of Stalingrad and the advancing Soviet forces. No poison gas is used against them. Then the Americans land on the beach. Still no poison gas.

    Here's the bottom line. Would a country ever use nuclear weapons to bomb itself? Because that is effectively what it is doing if it fires nukes at a country with nukes.

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    Re: How long will it take for peace to come to the world?

    Quote Originally Posted by jbk1203 View Post
    Firstly for your first paragraph; i have no wish to debate whether i made a mistake or not, i have my opinion and you have yours which i respect. Now i look back on my reply i realise that i have indeed just repeated myself. I do agree that the threat of WW3 is surpressed by the exhistance of nuclear weapons, but i am saying that if for some reason that WW3 did break out for another reason and countries were willing to use nuclear weapons, it would kill most of the human race.

    ---------- Post added at 03:53 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:48 PM ----------

    I think that most of the world does want peace; however i think that we are not doing enough to stop the nutbags that blow up towers and subways etc.
    Nukes kill people. they are a deterrant, but, they are a bad thing. nukes can be stolen and hacked too.

    To remove the wars from the world you need to satisfy all countries needs and wants. if the president wants a war to get more resources, the people won't support them, and, facing exits in the voting polls, there will be no war. so, we need to satisfy them.

    In africa and south america and asia - the area where the real wars take place - it is all about grazing land. if the soil from the unused areas or america only was transported there, they could have great grass for their livestock to eat. then, there will be no support from the common people.

    In places like europe and the near east, there is only racism and things like that. if the world was to broadcast western ideas to these places, the views will change.

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    Re: How long will it take for peace to come to the world?

    Howdy! This thought popped into mind: Are you figuring Islam's ferocious lust for the Allah-ordered "Jihad" (Holy War);

    Or, the Christian fundamentalists' ferocious lust for the Apocalyptic "Armageddon" into your world peace equation???


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    Re: How long will it take for peace to come to the world?

    Quote Originally Posted by Charlatan2 View Post
    To remove the wars from the world you need to satisfy all countries needs and wants. if the president wants a war to get more resources, the people won't support them, and, facing exits in the voting polls, there will be no war. so, we need to satisfy them.
    You can never satisfy all needs and wants with the scarce resources in this world. This is why millionaires don't stop making money. Besides, there will always be poor people in any country.

    Quote Originally Posted by Charlatan2 View Post
    In africa and south america and asia - the area where the real wars take place - it is all about grazing land. if the soil from the unused areas or america only was transported there, they could have great grass for their livestock to eat. then, there will be no support from the common people.
    If a country wants self-determination, instead of being a satellite state, it needs a powerful military. This depends on a large population. The more soil a country gives away, the fewer children it can afford to raise and feed. If there is one welfare program I approve of, it is getting more soil from pathetic countries in those places you mentioned.

    Quote Originally Posted by Charlatan2 View Post
    In places like europe and the near east, there is only racism and things like that. if the world was to broadcast western ideas to these places, the views will change.
    People in the Middle East have been fighting over ethnic and religious differences for thousands of years. But the one thing they have more in common is a hatred of Western ideas.

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    Re: How long will it take for peace to come to the world?

    Quote Originally Posted by Quicky View Post
    You can never satisfy all needs and wants with the scarce resources in this world.
    Can you please support this.


    People in the Middle East have been fighting over ethnic and religious differences for thousands of years. But the one thing they have more in common is a hatred of Western ideas.
    What western ideas existed thousands of years ago for them to hate?
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