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  1. #81
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    Re: Republican Hypocracies

    http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-s...d=sm_fb_maddow

    Trump ignores his own ‘Buy American, Hire American’ rule



    "On Friday night, after wrapping up one of nine self-indulgent post-campaign campaign rallies, Donald Trump declared via Twitter, “My administration will follow two very simple rules: buy American and hire American.” A day later, during another self-congratulatory event, the president-elect repeated the identical phrase to an Alabama audience.

    Perhaps Trump assumes we all have very short memories – and no one noticed this Palm Beach Post report published just last week.
    President-elect Donald Trump is driving a hard bargain for the foreign workers who will staff The Mar-a-Lago Club this winter. He’s paying some of them less than they made this past year, and most get just a 1 percent raise.

    As the presidential campaign heated up, Trump won approval to hire 64 foreign workers through the federal government’s H-2B visa program, according to newly released data from the U.S. Labor Department. This past year, Trump was allowed to hire 69 foreign workers at Mar-a-Lago.
    Asked during the GOP primaries why he hires so many foreign workers, Trump said, “It’s very, very hard to get people.”

    Hmm. So Trump’s “very simple” principle apparently comes with some fine print: “Hire American, unless it’s difficult, in which case, don’t worry about it.”"

    *snicker*
    "Real Boys Kiss Boys" -M.L.

  2. #82
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    Re: Republican Hypocracies

    Team Trump: Americans will not see the president’s tax returns

    This from the "birther-in-chief"

    "Postscript: I’d remind the new West Wing team that plenty of things get litigated during a campaign, but receive post-election follow-up. For example, right-wing conspiracy theories about President Obama’s birthplace arose in 2008. Most voters didn’t care, but Obama nevertheless released his long-form birth certificate during his first term.

    Perhaps Trump remembers hearing something about this.

    Second Postscript: If it turns out Trump wasn’t facing an IRS audit, and he simply lied his way through 2016, how big a scandal would it deserve to be?"
    "Real Boys Kiss Boys" -M.L.

  3. #83
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    Re: Republican Hypocracies

    Quote Originally Posted by CowboyX View Post
    For example, right-wing conspiracy theories about President Obama’s birthplace arose in 2008.
    How could they have arisen in the "right wing" given their origins in the Clinton campaign?
    "Suffering lies not with inequality, but with dependence." -Voltaire
    "Fallacies do not cease to be fallacies because they become fashions.” -G.K. Chesterton
    Also, if you think I've overlooked your post please shoot me a PM, I'm not intentionally ignoring you.


  4. #84
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    Re: Republican Hypocracies

    Quote Originally Posted by Squatch347 View Post
    How could they have arisen in the "right wing" given their origins in the Clinton campaign?
    Support or retract that it originated from the Clinton campaign.

    I will support that it didn't, but my challenge still stands (just to keep the burden of proof where it belongs.).

    Numerous fact checks, reports and interviews — in 2008 and 2011, when Trump revived the controversy — revealed that although some Clinton supporters circulated rumors about Obama’s citizenship, the campaign and Clinton herself never trafficked in it.

    “There has never been evidence that Clinton or her campaign started the birther rumors,” said Ben Smith, editor in chief of BuzzFeed, who as a POLITICO reporter in 2011 linked the origin of the “birther” movement to a fringe politician in Illinois. Some hardcore Clinton backers circulated the rumors in 2008, but the campaign itself steered clear.

    “As we reported, some of her supporters flirted with the idea in 2008 — but it has its origins in the fever swamps beginning in Illinois in 2004,” he said.

    In fact, birtherism, as it’s been called, reportedly began with innuendo by serial Illinois political candidate Andy Martin, who painted Obama as a closet Muslim in 2004. That spiraled into a concerted effort by conspiracy theorists to raise doubts about Obama’s birthplace and religion — and essentially paint him as un-American.


    http://www.politico.com/story/2016/0...clinton-228304

  5. #85
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    Re: Republican Hypocracies

    Quote Originally Posted by mican333 View Post
    Support or retract that it originated from the Clinton campaign.
    Sure, the original claim was brought up by two Clinton campaign members. One, was an underling and fired. The other was Mr. Blumenthal, who still works with Ms. Clinton.
    http://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/poli...102354777.html


    The rumor was then spread around the campaign's supporters and base before taking life among Republicans after Obama won the nomination.
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...upporters.html

    This was confirmed via tweet and interview later by Patti Doyle, a Clinton Campaign Manager.
    http://www.breitbart.com/big-governm...erism-started/
    "Suffering lies not with inequality, but with dependence." -Voltaire
    "Fallacies do not cease to be fallacies because they become fashions.” -G.K. Chesterton
    Also, if you think I've overlooked your post please shoot me a PM, I'm not intentionally ignoring you.


  6. #86
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    Re: Republican Hypocracies

    Quote Originally Posted by Squatch347 View Post
    Sure, the original claim was brought up by two Clinton campaign members. One, was an underling and fired. The other was Mr. Blumenthal, who still works with Ms. Clinton.
    http://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/poli...102354777.html
    They did not originate the claim. From your link.

    "Two supporters of Hillary Clinton’s 2008 presidential campaign reportedly shared the claim that then-rival Barack Obama was not born in the United States and thus was not eligible to be president."

    As I supported in my last post, the claim originated elsewhere.
    Last edited by mican333; January 24th, 2017 at 01:07 PM.

  7. Likes CowboyX liked this post
  8. #87
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    Re: Republican Hypocracies

    Quote Originally Posted by mican333 View Post
    They did not originate the claim.
    I think you are engaging in a equivocation fallacy here. "Share" does not imply they didn't create the story, only that they were the sources of the information. ie: "to give specific users access to (online content), as by posting it on a social-media website or sending it as an email attachment: "

    The context of the article clearly implies that they are the primary source from which the conspiracy started, that it was their emails that started the widespread discussion. '

    It was not until April 2008, at the height of the intensely bitter Democratic presidential primary process, that the touch paper was properly lit.

    An anonymous email circulated by supporters of Mrs Clinton, Mr Obama’s main rival for the party’s nomination, thrust a new allegation into the national spotlight — that he had not been born in Hawaii.
    Second Source


    That Clinton staffers were the source of the original distribution that led to widespread media attention doesn't even seem controversial:

    Politico explained it in detail, hell even factcheck.org notes that it started on the left. The lawsuit that caught Trump's real attention and which he cited for a while was from a former Clinton campaign operative.


    We also should point out that Sydney Blumenthal, long time Clinton operative is mentioned in the first link and cited frequently as a source of information in the early days of this conspiracy theory.

    former McClatchy Washington Bureau Chief James Asher tweeted Friday that Blumenthal had “told me in person” that Obama was born in Kenya.

    “During the 2008 Democratic primary, Sid Blumenthal visited the Washington Bureau of McClatchy Co.,” Asher said in an email Friday to McClatchy, noting that he was at the time the investigative editor and in charge of Africa coverage.

    “During that meeting, Mr. Blumenthal and I met together in my office and he strongly urged me to investigate the exact place of President Obama’s birth, which he suggested was in Kenya. We assigned a reporter to go to Kenya, and that reporter determined that the allegation was false.

    “At the time of Mr. Blumenthal’s conversation with me, there had been a few news articles published in various outlets reporting on rumors about Obama’s birthplace. While Mr. Blumenthal offered no concrete proof of Obama’s Kenyan birth, I felt that, as journalists, we had a responsibility to determine whether or not those rumors were true. They were not.”

    First Link
    "Suffering lies not with inequality, but with dependence." -Voltaire
    "Fallacies do not cease to be fallacies because they become fashions.” -G.K. Chesterton
    Also, if you think I've overlooked your post please shoot me a PM, I'm not intentionally ignoring you.


  9. #88
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    Re: Republican Hypocracies

    Republicans endlessly criticized Obama's use of executive order as lawless and unconstitutional - especially in regards to the ACA.

    Not so much now and even telling in that republicans have control of congress.
    "Real Boys Kiss Boys" -M.L.

  10. #89
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    Re: Republican Hypocracies

    2 weeks in and Trump going on vacation? Will he be playing golf?

    Republicans surprisingly quiet.
    "Real Boys Kiss Boys" -M.L.

  11. #90
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    Re: Republican Hypocracies

    Quote Originally Posted by COWBOY
    2 weeks in and Trump going on vacation? Will he be playing golf?

    Republicans surprisingly quiet.
    Well, I for one am silent, because I see no context in your post.
    A question and a link?
    http://www.miamiherald.com/news/poli...127106464.html
    Apparently this is really just a revenge tour for him
    You would have to read deep into the link to find that connection. kinda like "where is waldo" of links to a point.


    Quote Originally Posted by LINK
    Trump, who promised never to take vacations, will be working at the mansion.

    Read more here: http://www.miamiherald.com/news/poli...#storylink=cpy
    http://www.miamiherald.com/news/poli...129995849.html
    Ah.. that's why no one is raising an eye to this.. except the crazy conspiracy theorists.

    P.S. I'm not back yet.. just tired of being so swamped at work.
    I apologize to anyone waiting on a response from me. I am experiencing a time warp, suddenly their are not enough hours in a day. As soon as I find a replacement part to my flux capacitor regulator, time should resume it's normal flow.

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  13. #91
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    Re: Republican Hypocracies

    Quote Originally Posted by MindTrap028 View Post
    Ah.. that's why no one is raising an eye to this.. except the crazy conspiracy theorists.
    and yet it didn't stop the "conspiracy theorists" concerning Obama.

    http://www.cbsnews.com/videos/duty-s...aii-vacations/

    hypocrisy confirmed
    "Real Boys Kiss Boys" -M.L.

  14. #92
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    Re: Republican Hypocracies

    Hmm, Cowboy, if the Republicans are being hypocrites on these issues, aren't you also engaging in hypocrisy by engaging in the criticism you once defended?
    "Suffering lies not with inequality, but with dependence." -Voltaire
    "Fallacies do not cease to be fallacies because they become fashions.” -G.K. Chesterton
    Also, if you think I've overlooked your post please shoot me a PM, I'm not intentionally ignoring you.


  15. #93
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    Re: Republican Hypocracies

    Quote Originally Posted by COWBOY
    and yet it didn't stop the "conspiracy theorists" concerning Obama.

    http://www.cbsnews.com/videos/duty-s...aii-vacations/

    hypocrisy confirmed
    I am afraid I don't see the comparison. Maybe explain the link a bit?
    Basically trump is supposed to be working. If he is meeting people and not on the golf course, then this is an example of complaint without substance.
    Also, I don't think people complained THAT obama took vacations. It was the volume of them and specifically in relation to important social events.
    If trump does the same.. then maybe you have room to complain about hypocracy. But it would have to be the same first.

    I think it is kinda early to take a vacation for him at this point, but it isn't clear that he is doing so.. yet.

    Also, he has a long 4 years of campaigning ahead of him.. since he is going to run again... soooo maybe he is resting up for the long race
    I apologize to anyone waiting on a response from me. I am experiencing a time warp, suddenly their are not enough hours in a day. As soon as I find a replacement part to my flux capacitor regulator, time should resume it's normal flow.

  16. #94
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    Re: Republican Hypocracies

    Quote Originally Posted by MindTrap028 View Post
    Basically trump is supposed to be working. If he is meeting people and not on the golf course, then this is an example of complaint without substance.
    and as I supported Obama worked on some of his vacations but that didn't stop the criticism. Adding that it was the volume is simply moving the goal posts.
    "Real Boys Kiss Boys" -M.L.

  17. #95
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    Re: Republican Hypocracies

    Trump doesn't take briefing seriously enough to leave his dinner and Navy Seal dies:

    "looks like President Trump got briefed on it, by and large, at a dinner, not in the Situation Room, not with legal advisers around."

    "Usually, a president goes down in the Situation Room, is presented with what they call a full package for the attack. There’s a legal assessment of the legal authorities under which they’re doing these. There’s a risk assessment to the commandos who would be doing it. There is a risk assessment of what could happen to civilians who are in the area."

    When will the hearings start?
    "Real Boys Kiss Boys" -M.L.

  18. #96
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    Re: Republican Hypocracies

    Quote Originally Posted by CowboyX View Post
    When will the hearings start?
    For a group so concerned with fake news, you guys sure do push a lot of it:

    The botched military operation in Yemen that killed a US Navy SEAL and over a dozen al Qaeda terrorists and civilians had been in the works for months before President Trump approved it shortly after taking office, according to a published report.

    In the waning months of his presidency, Barack Obama was hashing out with the Pentagon the Yemen attack plan that was aimed at gathering intelligence on al Qaeda for future strikes against the jihadist group to wipe them out, CNN said.

    Obama administration officials cited “operational reasons” for pushing back the date of the raid for sometime after Jan. 20, leaving it in the hands of the newly minted president to determine its course, CNN reported.

    http://www.thepoliticalinsider.com/r...#ixzz4Xe3rOWfO

    How long do you guys think it takes to plan one of these raids? It isn't a 24 hour kinda thing, they take months.

    Side Note, the operational reasons were waiting for a new moon.
    "Suffering lies not with inequality, but with dependence." -Voltaire
    "Fallacies do not cease to be fallacies because they become fashions.” -G.K. Chesterton
    Also, if you think I've overlooked your post please shoot me a PM, I'm not intentionally ignoring you.


  19. Likes MindTrap028, Belthazor liked this post
  20. #97
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    Re: Republican Hypocracies

    Quote Originally Posted by Squatch347 View Post
    For a group so concerned with fake news, you guys sure do push a lot of it:
    *whoops* Squatch shield was down there for a sec.

    Challenge to support a claim. Everything in your post you quoted was in the support from the original post, please support where you believe the "fake news" is.

    I doubt your sides reaction would have been the same had it been Hillary, so thanks for verifying that for me.
    "Real Boys Kiss Boys" -M.L.

  21. #98
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    Re: Republican Hypocracies

    Quote Originally Posted by COWBOY
    and as I supported Obama worked on some of his vacations but that didn't stop the criticism. Adding that it was the volume is simply moving the goal posts.
    Again, no connection. The complaint by the right was that Obama had so many vacations. Not that he went on any specific one, except in cases where was an expectation for the president to be involved in something that was going on.
    Like if bush would have been on vacation for 911, and stayed out golfing for 3 more days.
    Maybe not as clear of grounds, but that is the reasoning, so you have to attack the actual position of the right and not a strawman you make up to make yourself feel better.

    Quote Originally Posted by COWBOY
    Trump doesn't take briefing seriously enough to leave his dinner and Navy Seal dies:

    "looks like President Trump got briefed on it, by and large, at a dinner, not in the Situation Room, not with legal advisers around."

    "Usually, a president goes down in the Situation Room, is presented with what they call a full package for the attack. There’s a legal assessment of the legal authorities under which they’re doing these. There’s a risk assessment to the commandos who would be doing it. There is a risk assessment of what could happen to civilians who are in the area."

    When will the hearings start?
    I have to say I'm taking this as sarcasm and ironic use of "fake news" to highlight what you feel is past wrongs by the right.

    I'm afraid I don't don't see the connection to any of them.

    Did the right complain when the Obama Got BinLaden and there were problems with the operation?

    For the most part no, because we generally hold to letting the military do it's thang.
    edit: Personally, I would have a rubber stamp made, and give it to the top general who knows what is going on. .. but that is just me.

    All in all, you have very few more silly complaints before I start tuning you out as white noise from the peanut gallery. Just sayen.
    Maybe even "super saiyen"?
    I apologize to anyone waiting on a response from me. I am experiencing a time warp, suddenly their are not enough hours in a day. As soon as I find a replacement part to my flux capacitor regulator, time should resume it's normal flow.

  22. #99
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    Re: Republican Hypocracies

    Quote Originally Posted by CowboyX View Post
    Challenge to support a claim. Everything in your post you quoted was in the support from the original post, please support where you believe the "fake news" is.
    Your request is internally incoherent. Do you want me to support a claim or are you asking what my belief is? Those are two different requests.

    The former is the more restrictive, so I will assume you mean that.

    Your final statement was: "When will the hearings start?" It was immediately following the statement that there should have been a risk assessment about civilian casualties. The message you are imparting is that the Trump administration was negligent. However, it was the Navy under the Obama administration that planned the event. It was the Obama administration that approved the plan and the Obama Administration's civilian appointees that approved the CDE (collateral damage estimate). The Navy requested a delay for the new moon, and so the mission had to be re-authorized. But nothing about that delay affected the plan or the CDE (which the President doesn't even approve anyway, that is the CENTCOM commander). Thus the implication that this was a failure of oversight on the current administration's part is, in the vernacular of the day, fake news. The CDE isn't approved by the President under current CENTCOM guidance, the operational approval didn't fall to Mr. Trump, and the fact that the entire process except the date was already pre-approved means if there was a failure of oversight (and I don't think there was) it was Mr. Obama's.
    "Suffering lies not with inequality, but with dependence." -Voltaire
    "Fallacies do not cease to be fallacies because they become fashions.” -G.K. Chesterton
    Also, if you think I've overlooked your post please shoot me a PM, I'm not intentionally ignoring you.


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  24. #100
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    Re: Republican Hypocracies

    Quote Originally Posted by Squatch347 View Post

    Your final statement was: "When will the hearings start?" It was immediately following the statement that there should have been a risk assessment about civilian casualties. The message you are imparting is that the Trump administration was negligent. However, it was the Navy under the Obama administration that planned the event. It was the Obama administration that approved the plan and the Obama Administration's civilian appointees that approved the CDE (collateral damage estimate). The Navy requested a delay for the new moon, and so the mission had to be re-authorized. But nothing about that delay affected the plan or the CDE (which the President doesn't even approve anyway, that is the CENTCOM commander). Thus the implication that this was a failure of oversight on the current administration's part is, in the vernacular of the day, fake news. The CDE isn't approved by the President under current CENTCOM guidance, the operational approval didn't fall to Mr. Trump, and the fact that the entire process except the date was already pre-approved means if there was a failure of oversight (and I don't think there was) it was Mr. Obama's.
    Challenge to support a claim. Please support or retract that President Trump did indeed have a "full package for the attack" and that it is not a fact that he didn't, or, as you put it it is "fake news".

    ---------- Post added at 01:01 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:55 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by MindTrap028 View Post
    Again, no connection. The complaint by the right was that Obama had so many vacations. Not that he went on any specific one
    Not. "President @BarackObama's vacation is costing taxpayers millions of dollars----Unbelievable!" Tweet from Donald Trump.

    ---------- Post added at 01:05 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:01 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by MindTrap028 View Post

    I have to say I'm taking this as sarcasm and ironic use of "fake news" to highlight what you feel is past wrongs by the right.

    I'm afraid I don't don't see the connection to any of them.

    I absolutely refuse to believe both you and Squatch don't believe that if Hillary Clinton had done the same exact thing the right would be HOWLING about the death of that SEAL.

    and there would be hearings and calls for investigations and she hates the military and blah, blah, blah.
    "Real Boys Kiss Boys" -M.L.

 

 
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