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  1. #1
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    Donald Rumsfeld: "I'm Not Santa Claus"

    For those who ever thought of Donald Rumsfeld as Santa Claus, I'm sorry to inform you that it isn't true. Donald has put to rest all the rumors once and for all during an airborne interview enroute to Anchorage, Alaska.

    Don finally came clean about his St. Nick connection prior to a meeting with the families of Alaska's 172nd Stryker Brigade. The Fort Wainwright families recently learned that the 172nd's tour of duty in Iraq had been extended due to unforeseen developments in Baghdad (more 'progress' apparently). Having believed the army's earlier predictions that American force levels would decrease this year, the Alaskan families made preparations for joyous yuletide homecomings.

    Donald Rumsfeld was on his way to Alaska to address the obviously distraught and heartbroken military families. What words might comfort these folks?

    Rummy chose these: "I'm not Santa Claus." Apparently, Rumsfeld had come to Alaska to dispel the vicious rumor that he, the architect of the Iraq War, had any resemblance to Santa Claus.

    To show the Alaskan military families that he was indeed not the jolly fat fellow in red, the Defense Secretary added this: “These people [the Alaskans' loved ones] are all volunteers. They all signed up. They all are there doing what they’re doing because they want to do it. They’re proud of what they do. They do it very, very well.”

    So there you have it. The military families best stop their bellyaching and snuff their expectations for any Christmas gifts from Washington, D.C. Their boys signed a contract. Don't get angry at Rummy, you Alaskan families. Didn't you read the fine print?

    Question: Don't you think these Alaskan military families need a little "tough love" right about now? I mean, how can we win a war when our military families don't even know the fine print of their contracts! We have to toughen these people up.

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14533814/

  2. #2
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    Re: Donald Rumsfeld: "I'm Not Santa Claus"

    Quote Originally Posted by manise View Post
    Question: Don't you think these Alaskan military families need a little "tough love" right about now? I mean, how can we win a war when our military families don't even know the fine print of their contracts! We have to toughen these people up.
    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14533814/
    In this case I think this was a very poor choice of words to use to families that have loved ones that are in harms way. It is really not suprising though, especially considering the source. This is just another case that shows just how much these people are interested in the wellfare of our implements of warfare.
    On the other hand he is correct in the fact that he makes reference to the volunteer factor. Trust me on this one, it is not just in the fine print. When you go into the military it is made quite clear, all throughout the process that you are basically goverment property for your little stay with them. However this still does not excuse his choice of wording here. His social skills seem to be no better than his military tactical ones.
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    Re: Donald Rumsfeld: "I'm Not Santa Claus"

    Just look at this face - isn't it a face you can trust?


    Rumsfeld also was to tour the missile defense site at Fort Greely, near Fairbanks, where interceptor rockets in underground silos are being developed for potential use in the event of a long-range missile attack on U.S. soil. A test of portions of the system is scheduled to be held in a few days.
    Why do they advertise this stuff?
    While laughing at others stupidity, you may want to contemplate your own comedic talents. (link)
    Disclaimer: This information is being provided for informational, educational, and entertainment purposes only.

  4. #4
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    Re: Donald Rumsfeld: "I'm Not Santa Claus"

    Quote Originally Posted by Snoop View Post
    Just look at this face - isn't it a face you can trust?


    Why do they advertise this stuff?
    Because in nuclear war it's all about showing the strongest hand

  5. #5
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    Re: Donald Rumsfeld: "I'm Not Santa Claus"

    Well, I don't feel sorry for the soldiers at war if that's your excuse, Manise. It's like this:

    Anyone who signs a contract to be a soldier and then wonders how it's possible that they're going to war should kill themselves.

    It's like joining a bowling team and asking why you have to throw a ball --it just doesn't make any sense.


    On the other hand, Rummy is, from what I've heard, a horrible general.

  6. #6
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    Re: Donald Rumsfeld: "I'm Not Santa Claus"

    Quote Originally Posted by GoldPhoenix View Post
    Well, I don't feel sorry for the soldiers at war if that's your excuse, Manise. It's like this:

    Anyone who signs a contract to be a soldier and then wonders how it's possible that they're going to war should kill themselves.

    It's like joining a bowling team and asking why you have to throw a ball --it just doesn't make any sense.
    I agree with you, GP. If you sign a contract to do as you are told, you don't have much cause for bellyaching. Many of these families and soldiers were silent or downright giddy in 2003 about the prospect of "kicking some ass" in Iraq to avenge 911. Well, they signed the dotted line and got their little war and then some.

    On the other hand, if wars require public support, it would seem to me prudent not to further anger your most loyal backers--the military families. Rumsfeld's flippant remarks serve what purpose exactly, encouragement? It's one thing to kick Cindy Sheehan in the teeth for speaking out about the death of her son (who was killed by radical Shiites, not insurgents no less), and quite another to tell families with still living loved ones in Iraq to basically reread their contracts with the US government and stop hoping for "Santa Claus."

    Rumsfeld's manner of giving pep talks needs some work I think.
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    Re: Donald Rumsfeld: "I'm Not Santa Claus"

    Quote Originally Posted by manise View Post
    I agree with you, GP. If you sign a contract to do as you are told, you don't have much cause for bellyaching. Many of these families and soldiers were silent or downright giddy in 2003 about the prospect of "kicking some ass" in Iraq to avenge 911. Well, they signed the dotted line and got their little war and then some.

    On the other hand, if wars require public support, it would seem to me prudent not to further anger your most loyal backers--the military families. Rumsfeld's flippant remarks serve what purpose exactly, encouragement? It's one thing to kick Cindy Sheehan in the teeth for speaking out about the death of her son (who was killed by radical Shiites, not insurgents no less), and quite another to tell families with still living loved ones in Iraq to basically reread their contracts with the US government and stop hoping for "Santa Claus."

    Rumsfeld's manner of giving pep talks needs some work I think.
    I think we're all pretty certain he can't conduct a war and that he's an ass.

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    Re: Donald Rumsfeld: "I'm Not Santa Claus"

    Quote Originally Posted by GoldPhoenix View Post
    I think we're all pretty certain he can't conduct a war and that he's an ass.
    There are still some diehard Rummy apologists out there in cyberland, though it's getting harder to admit these days.
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    Re: Donald Rumsfeld: "I'm Not Santa Claus"

    "‘I’d love to be Santa Claus’
    The brigade’s tour was extended by up to 120 days, bringing them close to a Christmas return date. Rumsfeld said he would make no promises that the full brigade would be back home by the holidays.

    “I’d love to be Santa Claus. I’m not,” he said in an interview with reporters during a flight to Fairbanks.

    If it turned out that by December, U.S. commanders in Iraq felt they needed an unscheduled infusion of troops, “our first choice obviously would be to have them be someone other than the people we just extended,” Rumsfeld said. “But I’m not going to get into the promises business. That isn’t my style.”

    On Sunday, Rumsfeld and Russian Defense Minister Sergei Ivanov planned to participate in a ceremony in Fairbanks for a memorial of the Alaska-Siberia Lend Lease program. During World War II, nearly 8,000 U.S. warplanes were flown to Fairbanks by U.S. pilots and turned over to Soviet pilots for use against the Germans.

    Rumsfeld also was to tour the missile defense site at Fort Greely, near Fairbanks, where interceptor rockets in underground silos are being developed for potential use in the event of a long-range missile attack on U.S. soil. A test of portions of the system is scheduled to be held in a few days."

    I'm not sure what the fuss is about. He essentially said that he would like to give them the gift of being with their loved ones at Christmas, but it is not possible. He repeatedly said what a great job the soldiers are doing, and reminded them that their relatives had joined the military of their own volition, and it was their own desire to be fighting for their country.

    One knows it is a slow news day when all Manise can find to indict Republican leaders is quoting unremarkable comments out of context.

  10. #10
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    Re: Donald Rumsfeld: "I'm Not Santa Claus"

    Quote Originally Posted by KevinBrowning View Post
    One knows it is a slow news day when all Manise can find to indict Republican leaders is quoting unremarkable comments out of context.
    Yes, I suppose Rummy telling military families to read their contracts and essentially get over it is rather unremarkable for the man. The families should kiss his feet to show their undying gratitude for the Rumster's words of comfort.

    As I said, these whining military folks need some tough love about now.

    But, Kevin, this "slow news day" also included 50 more dead across Iraq and the Iraqi PM saying there was no "civil war." We certainly can talk about that Rummy related news story if Rummy Santa Claus is too boring for you. Just say the word.
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    Re: Donald Rumsfeld: "I'm Not Santa Claus"

    Quote Originally Posted by manise View Post
    Yes, I suppose Rummy telling military families to read their contracts and essentially get over it is rather unremarkable for the man. The families should kiss his feet to show their undying gratitude for the Rumster's words of comfort.

    As I said, these whining military folks need some tough love about now.
    I'm not sure how you're getting all that out of a simple comment that he would like to reunite them with their families, but it is not possible yet.

    But, Kevin, this "slow news day" also included 50 more dead across Iraq and the Iraqi PM saying there was no "civil war." We certainly can talk about that Rummy related news story if Rummy Santa Claus is too boring for you. Just say the word.
    50 dead. Alright, how is that amazing? A whole lot more people than that die every day from AIDS, cancer, you name it.

    Sorry, but it seems you are grasping at straws by vilifying Rumsfeld over such insignificant remarks.

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    Re: Donald Rumsfeld: "I'm Not Santa Claus"

    Quote Originally Posted by KevinBrowning View Post
    I'm not sure how you're getting all that out of a simple comment that he would like to reunite them with their families, but it is not possible yet.



    50 dead. Alright, how is that amazing? A whole lot more people than that die every day from AIDS, cancer, you name it.

    Sorry, but it seems you are grasping at straws by vilifying Rumsfeld over such insignificant remarks.
    Kev,

    You should understand by now that vilifying any effort from the right or anything the U.S. does for that manner, is her Modus operandi.

  13. #13
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    Re: Donald Rumsfeld: "I'm Not Santa Claus"

    Quote Originally Posted by KevinBrowning View Post
    On Sunday, Rumsfeld and Russian Defense Minister Sergei Ivanov planned to participate in a ceremony in Fairbanks for a memorial of the Alaska-Siberia Lend Lease program. During World War II, nearly 8,000 U.S. warplanes were flown to Fairbanks by U.S. pilots and turned over to Soviet pilots for use against the Germans.
    The Soviets would have been faced with an even tougher time if it wasn't for the huge amounts of gift and lend-lease stuff that they got from the US and also from UK stocks. Nearly 2,000 British aircraft were also supplied, including over 1,300 Spitfires, and numbers of the very capable 'Wooden Wonder' - the Mosquito.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...,_World_War_II
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  14. #14
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    Re: Donald Rumsfeld: "I'm Not Santa Claus"

    You know, I read the op and said "Damn...that Rumsfeld really is an insensitive dolt. Apparently he got frustrated and lost his cool when speaking to the families of our boys overseas...shame on him". I didn't bother to actually read the article reference in the op as I just believed that manise was telling the truth. Lesson learned...I'll never make that mistake again and instead, will check every article to ensure that what manise claims occured...actually did.

    KB already refuted your out of context, radical leftist spin manise...but I thought I'd summarize with a concise post to expose the incredibly flawed objection based on events that never happened the way that you claimed they did, thus offering no foundation for your objections. You simply MISREAD what happened in the article...or you never even read the article. My guess is that you were motivated to post this after reading a liberal blogger or something.

    On with the facts...

    Quote Originally Posted by manise View Post
    Donald Rumsfeld was on his way to Alaska to address the obviously distraught and heartbroken military families. What words might comfort these folks?

    Rummy chose these: "I'm not Santa Claus." Apparently, Rumsfeld had come to Alaska to dispel the vicious rumor that he, the architect of the Iraq War, had any resemblance to Santa Claus.
    You need to brush up on your analysis skills there manise. Almost your entire post was about a single statement or point, that was never made.

    There were 2 inteviews, the 1st was to the reporters on the plane, the 2nd to the families.

    This is what his point/statement to the families actually was (sometimes, you have to read past the headlines):
    Rumsfeld to the soldiers families (re: the 120 day deployment extension): It is something we don’t want to do...but in this case we had to.

    Families: Will another brigade take over at the end of the 120 deployment? (paraphrased)

    Rumsfeld: I wish I had a magic wand and the power to say yes. I don’t. I will do everything in the world I can do to see that they are not extended beyond the 120 days.
    That's it! End there. That's as far as we get into the quotes re: the discussion between Rummy and the soldiers family. NOTHING more manise.

    To show the Alaskan military families that he was indeed not the jolly fat fellow in red, the Defense Secretary added this: “These people [the Alaskans' loved ones] are all volunteers. They all signed up. They all are there doing what they’re doing because they want to do it. They’re proud of what they do. They do it very, very well.”
    No, that's not what happened. Shame on you manise. He gave 2 interviews, one to reporters on the plane to Alaska, and one to the families in Alaska.

    The interview on the plane to 5 reporters:
    Reporters: Do the soldiers or their families have any reason or right to be angry with you? (paraphrased)

    Rumsfeld: I don’t put it in that context, these people are all volunteers. They all signed up. They all are there doing what they’re doing because they want to do it. They’re proud of what they do. They do it very, very well.

    Reporters: Will the brigade be back for the holidays? (paraphrased)

    Rumsfeld: I’d love to be Santa Claus. I’m not. [re: if US commanders needed troops at the time] ...our first choice obviously would be to have them be someone other than the people we just extended, but I’m not going to get into the promises business. That isn’t my style.
    So there you have it. The military families best stop their bellyaching and snuff their expectations for any Christmas gifts from Washington, D.C. Their boys signed a contract. Don't get angry at Rummy, you Alaskan families. Didn't you read the fine print?
    Nice try at the radical rhetoric, but thankfully, objective readers caught you and can now prevent this thread from going to a dark place where dreams die.

    Question: Don't you think these Alaskan military families need a little "tough love" right about now? I mean, how can we win a war when our military families don't even know the fine print of their contracts! We have to toughen these people up.
    Ahhhh...if only we lived in the upside down world of the left. What a goofy place it would be. There was no "tough love" manise. READ the article next time instead of the headline.

    The below text has been automerged with this post.

    KB already refuted your out of context, radical leftist spin manise...but I thought I'd summarize with a concise post.

    Quote Originally Posted by manise View Post
    Donald Rumsfeld was on his way to Alaska to address the obviously distraught and heartbroken military families. What words might comfort these folks?

    Rummy chose these: "I'm not Santa Claus." Apparently, Rumsfeld had come to Alaska to dispel the vicious rumor that he, the architect of the Iraq War, had any resemblance to Santa Claus.
    You need to brush up on your analysis skills there manise. Almost your entire post was about a single statement or point, that was never made.

    This is what his point/statement actually was (sometimes, you have to read past the headlines):
    Rumsfeld to the soldiers families (re: the 120 day deployment extension): It is something we don’t want to do...but in this case we had to.

    Families: Will another brigade take over at the end of the 120 deployment? (paraphrased)

    Rumsfeld: I wish I had a magic wand and the power to say yes. I don’t. I will do everything in the world I can do to see that they are not extended beyond the 120 days.
    That's it! End there. That's as far as we get into the quotes re: the discussion between Rummy and the soldiers family. NOTHING more manise. Where is the "tough love" exactly? Where is the insensitivity? What was wrong with his responses exactly? NOTHING, unless one wears radical leftist goggles, allowing him/her to see things that do not exist, and in turn, spin it with uber english (billiards) the likes of which have not been seen since the Iraqi Information Minister made his debut a few years ago.

    To show the Alaskan military families that he was indeed not the jolly fat fellow in red, the Defense Secretary added this: “These people [the Alaskans' loved ones] are all volunteers. They all signed up. They all are there doing what they’re doing because they want to do it. They’re proud of what they do. They do it very, very well.”
    No, that's not what happened. Shame on you manise. He gave 2 interviews, one to reporters on the plane to Alaska, and one to the families in Alaska.

    The interview on the plane to 5 reporters:
    Reporters: Do the soldiers or their families have any reason or right to be angry with you? (paraphrased)

    Rumsfeld: I don’t put it in that context,” he said. “These people are all volunteers. They all signed up. They all are there doing what they’re doing because they want to do it. They’re proud of what they do. They do it very, very well.

    Reporters: Will the brigade be back for the holidays? (paraphrased)

    Rumsfeld: I’d love to be Santa Claus. I’m not. [re: if US commanders needed troops at the time] ...our first choice obviously would be to have them be someone other than the people we just extended, but I’m not going to get into the promises business. That isn’t my style.
    So there you have it. The military families best stop their bellyaching and snuff their expectations for any Christmas gifts from Washington, D.C. Their boys signed a contract. Don't get angry at Rummy, you Alaskan families. Didn't you read the fine print?
    Nice try at the radical rhetoric, but thankfully, objective readers caught you and can now prevent this thread from going to a dark place where dreams die.

    Question: Don't you think these Alaskan military families need a little "tough love" right about now? I mean, how can we win a war when our military families don't even know the fine print of their contracts! We have to toughen these people up.
    Ahhhh...if only we lived in the upside down world of the left. What a goofy place it would be. There was no "tough love" manise. READ the article next time instead of the headline.

    If you are going to attack Bush, the administration or anyone connected to it, do it validly. If these people are truly as bad as is claimed...you shouldn't have to stoop so low as to try to conjure up wrong doings out of thin air. Either it is the exposure of desperation of the left to create such ridiculous objections that have no merit...or it is the case that the left...as many have said over the past several years...are just out of touch with reality. Which is it I wonder...

    The below text has been automerged with this post.

    Quote Originally Posted by manise View Post
    Yes, I suppose Rummy telling military families to read their contracts and essentially get over it is rather unremarkable for the man. The families should kiss his feet to show their undying gratitude for the Rumster's words of comfort.
    Problem: It didn't happen manise. Please pay attention to the article you are using as a source.
    Last edited by Apokalupsis; August 27th, 2006 at 10:17 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
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    Re: Donald Rumsfeld: "I'm Not Santa Claus"

    Quote Originally Posted by manise View Post
    Yes, I suppose Rummy telling military families to read their contracts and essentially get over it is rather unremarkable for the man.
    Well, Manise, you must understand, Rummy loves the troops. He loves honorable men. Honorable men fulfill their contracts. Their contracts obviously said something about globetrotting on behalf of P-NAC. Thus, as a lover of the troops, Rummy sends them into harms way for P-NAC, because that's who they swore an oath to, so that they could fulfill their contractual obligations and become honorable men.

    Plus, it is also probably a good male-bonding thing.
    Mark Foley: Leaving No Child's Behind

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    Re: Donald Rumsfeld: "I'm Not Santa Claus"

    Quote Originally Posted by RfrancisR View Post
    Well, Manise, you must understand, Rummy loves the troops. He loves honorable men. Honorable men fulfill their contracts. Their contracts obviously said something about globetrotting on behalf of P-NAC. Thus, as a lover of the troops, Rummy sends them into harms way for P-NAC, because that's who they swore an oath to, so that they could fulfill their contractual obligations and become honorable men.

    Plus, it is also probably a good male-bonding thing.
    Another unfortunate example of how the left is immune to facts, objectivity and reason, and instead prefers fiction and spin to justify their preconcieved ideas.

    Please see my above post for the truth of the matter.
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    Re: Donald Rumsfeld: "I'm Not Santa Claus"

    Quote Originally Posted by Apokalupsis View Post
    Another unfortunate example of how the left is immune to facts, objectivity and reason, and instead prefers fiction and spin to justify their preconcieved ideas.
    Project a bit? Or just ignore history? There is no question that the whole Iraq invasion was the brainchild of P-NAC well before 9-11. Rightist have a habit of lopping off history and taking things out of context to suit their desired spins. Then they are masters of projection and accuse us of the same thing. The rightist bent at projection has never been more obvious than now, except during the Clinton-Lewinsky joke where they tried to turn a sex scandal into a Watergate level government abuse of power. I don't want to hear jack coming from righties about taking things out of context. And reason and objectivity? Please. Before you claim a lack of it in others correct the über spin meisters at Fox.
    Mark Foley: Leaving No Child's Behind

    Once, at a congressional Christmas party at the White House, my ex-boyfriend Herb went up to Foley, who was with a female date, and said to him, "Why don't you get a real date?" — Barney Frank

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    Re: Donald Rumsfeld: "I'm Not Santa Claus"

    Quote Originally Posted by RfrancisR View Post
    Project a bit? Or just ignore history? There is no question that the whole Iraq invasion was the brainchild of P-NAC well before 9-11. Rightist have a habit of lopping off history and taking things out of context to suit their desired spins. Then they are masters of projection and accuse us of the same thing. The rightist bent at projection has never been more obvious than now, except during the Clinton-Lewinsky joke where they tried to turn a sex scandal into a Watergate level government abuse of power. I don't want to hear jack coming from righties about taking things out of context. And reason and objectivity? Please. Before you claim a lack of it in others correct the über spin meisters at Fox.
    For Christ's sake, please stay on topic. This isn't a discussion about "rightist" projections in that past, you are COMPLETELY ignoring the facts HERE.

    What exactly are you arguing here? What is your point? Manise obviously misquoted Rumsfeld... PERIOD. Completely took him out of context, and your excuse is...

    "WELL... I DON'T BELIEVE IT... BECAUSE IN THE PAST "RIGHTIES" HAVE TOOK US OUT OF CONTEXT... HMM HMM HMM, SO I'LL JUST SIT HERE AND NOT LOOK AT THE FACTS, BECAUSE FOX NEWS AND "RIGHTIES" ARE ALWAYS WRONG!!11!"

    "With His dying breath... He saved me, with His wounds... He healed me, with His life... He died for me, although I never met Him, He remembered... me."

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    Re: Donald Rumsfeld: "I'm Not Santa Claus"

    Quote Originally Posted by ShadowKnight View Post
    Completely took him out of context, and your excuse is...

    "WELL... I DON'T BELIEVE IT... BECAUSE IN THE PAST "RIGHTIES" HAVE TOOK US OUT OF CONTEXT... HMM HMM HMM, SO I'LL JUST SIT HERE AND NOT LOOK AT THE FACTS, BECAUSE FOX NEWS AND "RIGHTIES" ARE ALWAYS WRONG!!11!"

    That's not what I said at all.
    Mark Foley: Leaving No Child's Behind

    Once, at a congressional Christmas party at the White House, my ex-boyfriend Herb went up to Foley, who was with a female date, and said to him, "Why don't you get a real date?" — Barney Frank

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    Re: Donald Rumsfeld: "I'm Not Santa Claus"

    Quote Originally Posted by RfrancisR View Post
    Project a bit? Or just ignore history? There is no question that the whole Iraq invasion was the brainchild of P-NAC well before 9-11. Rightist have a habit of lopping off history and taking things out of context to suit their desired spins. Then they are masters of projection and accuse us of the same thing. The rightist bent at projection has never been more obvious than now, except during the Clinton-Lewinsky joke where they tried to turn a sex scandal into a Watergate level government abuse of power. I don't want to hear jack coming from righties about taking things out of context. And reason and objectivity? Please. Before you claim a lack of it in others correct the über spin meisters at Fox.
    When you can catch ME red-handed, apply this argument. You've been caught. Do the honorable thing and admit you were wrong. Learning is merely moving from a false view to a true view. You bought the falsities and spin of the left here, hook, line and sinker without examining ANY facts whatsoever.

    It's one thing to review the facts and be fooled by them...it's quite another not to even examine a single fact, assume it's true just because you don't like the target, and be completely wrong due to extreme bias and contempt.

    Living in ignorance, is not a good thing, no matter how well it is spun Francis.

    Futhermore, that the right does it, is no validation of the left NOT doing it. I merely said that YOU, what YOU did, was just another example of how the left does it, nothing more.

    That being said, please try to stay on topic.
    Last edited by Apokalupsis; August 30th, 2006 at 10:08 AM.
    -=]Apokalupsis[=-
    Senior Administrator
    -------------------------

    I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. - Thomas Jefferson




 

 
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