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  1. #1
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    Spanking to be illegal

    ...if certain nutjob Cali libs get their way that is.

    SACRAMENTO — A new bill wants to outlaw parents from spanking their children. The assemblywoman sponsoring the measure wants to protect those who can't defend themselves, but is it taking governing too far?

    Spanking is a touchy issue for many people. Some use it. Others don't. An assemblywoman wants to ban all forms, even a slap on the hand.

    Speaker Pro Temp Sally Lieber plans to introduce a bill that would ban any form of spanking on kids less than three years old. That's includes spanking hands, faces or bottoms. Lieber said, "That would include slapping spanking smacking hitting punching, any striking of a child."

    Lieber said, "The borders begin to blur and there ought to be a bright line in the law that says no hitting a child 3 years or under."

    We found parents on both sides of the spanking issue, but many, whether they agreed with spanking or not, felt the government shouldn't tell parents how to parent.

    Karen Fontaine is both a parent and grandparent. She said, "What else are they going to do next, are they going to take over and raise our children?"

    Kary Mansu is also a parent, "I think it's a moral issue, how do you put a moral issue into no law and law, how do you control it?"
    FOX40 KTXL | No Spanking Bill

    Here's another article:

    SACRAMENTO, Calif. _ The California Legislature is about to weigh in on a question that stirs impassioned debate among moms and dads: Should parents spank their children?

    Assemblywoman Sally Lieber, a Mountain View Democrat, wants to outlaw spanking children up to 3 years old. If she succeeds, California would become the first state in the nation to explicitly ban parents from smacking their kids.
    Making a swat on the behind a misdemeanor might seem a bit much for some _ and the chances of the idea becoming law appear slim, at best _ but Lieber begs to differ.

    "I think it's pretty hard to argue you need to beat a child 3 years old or younger," Lieber said. "Is it OK to whip a 1-year-old or a 6-month-old or a newborn?"

    The bill, which is still being drafted, will be written broadly, she added, prohibiting "any striking of a child, any corporal punishment, smacking, hitting, punching, any of that." Lieber said it would be a misdemeanor, punishable by up to a year in jail or a fine up to $1,000, although a legal expert advising her on the proposal said first-time offenders likely only would have to attend parenting classes.

    The idea is encountering skepticism even before it's been formally introduced. Beyond the debate among child psychologists _ many of whom believe limited spanking can be effective _ the bill is sure to face questions over how practical it is to enforce and opposition from some legislators who generally oppose what they consider "nanny government."

    "Where do you stop?" asked Assembly member Chuck DeVore, an Irvine Republican, who said he personally agrees children under 3 shouldn't be spanked but has no desire to make it the law. "At what point are we going to say we should pass a bill that every parent has to read a minimum of 30 minutes every night to their child? This is right along those same lines."
    One San Jose mother of three said she believes spanking is a poor way to discipline children, but she also wondered whether a legislative ban makes sense. Should a mom who slaps her misbehaving kid in the supermarket, she asked, be liable for a crime?

    "If my 6-year-old doesn't put his clothes in the hamper, I'm not going to whack him, he just won't get his clothes washed," said Peggy Hertzberg, 38, who teaches parenting classes at the YWCA. "I think instead of banning spanking, parents need to learn different ways of disciplining and redirecting their children."

    Lieber conceived the idea while chatting with a family friend and legal expert in children's issues worldwide. The friend, Thomas Nazario, said that while banning spanking might seem like a radical idea for the United States, more than 10 European countries already do so. Sweden was the first, in 1979.
    Nazario said there's no good rationale for hitting a child under 3, so the state should draw a "bright line" in the law making it clear.

    "Why do we allow parents to hit a little child and not someone their own size?" said Nazario, a professor at the University of San Francisco Law School. "Everyone in the state is protected from physical violence, so where do you draw the line? To take a child and spank his little butt until he starts crying, some people would define that as physical violence."

    It's unclear how a spanking ban would be enforced. Most slapping, after all, happens in the confines of a home, and most children up to age 3 aren't capable of reporting it.

    Doctors, social workers and others who believe a child has been abused are required by law to report it to authorities. Nazario said he and Lieber are still debating whether to treat slapping the same way, or simply to encourage those who witness it to report it. But in either case, said Lieber, the law "would allow people who view a beating to say, `Excuse me, that's against the law.'"

    Experts in child psychology disagree whether spanking is a legitimate or effective way for parents to discipline their children. Professor Robert Larzelere, who has studied child discipline for 30 years, said his research shows spanking is fine, as long as it's used sparingly and doesn't escalate to abuse.

    "If it's used in a limited way," the Oklahoma State University professor said, "it can be more effective than almost any other type of punishment." He added that children 18 months old or younger shouldn't be spanked at all, because they can't understand why it's happening.

    As for Lieber's proposal, the professor said: "I think this proposal is not just a step too far, it's a leap too far. At least from a scientific perspective there really isn't any research to support the idea that this would make things better for children."

    But Lieber is optimistic that lawmakers will find her proposal hard to resist. For the record, she does not have children and says she was not slapped as a child. But she does have a cat named Snoop, which her veterinarian told her never to hit.

    "And if you never hit a cat," Lieber said, "you should never hit a kid."
    Calif. lawmaker wants to make spanking a misdemeanor

    I find this most absurd on so many levels I don't know where to begin. Note: This isn't an issue about whether what the most effective disciplinary action is, nor whether or not spanking is effective (studies have shown that it can be effective for some kids and if done in a proper way). It is about making spanking, a crime. It is about government telling us how to raise our children. It's saying that spanking, should be punishable as abuse, just like cutting off parts of a child's tongue should be. Most...absurd.
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    Re: Spanking to be illegal...

    Quote Originally Posted by wikipedia article on spanking, reasons agianst section
    Even without sexual motives on the part of the punisher, some maintain that spanking

    can interfere with a child’s normal sexual and psychological development. Because the buttocks are so close to the genitals and so multiply linked to sexual nerve centers, slapping them can trigger powerful and involuntary sensations of sexual pleasure. This can happen even in very young children, and even in spite of great, clearly upsetting pain.[1]
    Dr. Teresa Whitehurst said "The literature is replete with accounts of rape victims who never came forward to name their accuser or even to admit they'd been violated because they were so ashamed at their bodies' involuntary response to touch, thinking that this would suggest they enjoyed the assault. Nerve endings can and do function without our conscious consent. The pendulum is beginning to turn against spanking and paddling as science amasses more and more evidence regarding the sexual role played by the buttocks, and the ways in which any touch--with a hand or with a paddle--can create unwelcome but unavoidable arousal." Dr. Teresa Whitehurst, member of ChristCentered Christians for Nonviolent Parenting (CCNP);

    I think the sexual issue is enough, even if it only takes place in a minority of cases, to outlaw the old over-the-knee, pants-down discipline.
    Last edited by Apokalupsis; January 19th, 2007 at 11:56 AM. Reason: fixed quote

  3. #3
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    Re: Spanking to be illegal...

    Sounds like more nutjub, liberal propaganda to me. The bill includes ALL forms of "spanking"...the kid doesn't have to be nekkid and bent over. Could have the diaper on and standing up, and the parent gives a quick swat on the bottom. Even a hand slap = possible 1 yr in jail away from the child.

    Absurd.

    This is advocating a nanny government.
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    Re: Spanking to be illegal...

    Quote Originally Posted by Apokalupsis View Post
    Sounds like more nutjub, liberal propaganda to me.
    Maybe, but if it means fewer grown men wanna be spanked, I'd say it's worth looking into

    Quote Originally Posted by Apokalupsis View Post
    The bill includes ALL forms of "spanking"...the kid doesn't have to be nekkid and bent over. Could have the diaper on and standing up, and the parent gives a quick swat on the bottom. Even a hand slap = possible 1 yr in jail away from the child.

    Absurd.


    This is advocating a nanny government.

    I'd have to agree there. A short smack may not be agreeable for other parents, but the government shouldn't be dictating the raising of a child unless valid cause is evident.
    Merely finding something distasteful isn't reason enough to outlaw it. If you don't like physical discipline, don't use it. Chances are your kid won't either.

    The below text has been automerged with this post.

    haha, think of the rukus a little 5 year old would make if he found out this bill passed. He'd go ape, and so long as he had a phone near-by, his parent's couldn't touch him.
    Last edited by Turtleflipper; January 19th, 2007 at 12:09 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

  5. #5
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    Re: Spanking to be illegal...

    Quote Originally Posted by Turtleflipper View Post
    Maybe, but if it means fewer grown men wanna be spanked, I'd say it's worth looking into
    Considering that studies show that spanking done properly is actually one of the best ways to discipline children, I'd say the opposite. It can result in many undisciplined children who of course, may face the consequences later in life.

    The evidence says that:

    1) spanking as the end-all-be-all solution as a disciplinary action for all children...isn't as effective as most other actions.

    2) spanking under the right circumstances and done appropriately, is better than most other actions.

    3) this bill says "spanking in any circumstance whatosever can result in taking the parent away from the child for up to a year".

    It's an extremist and radical position to have. Want to promote healthy discipline? Go for it, educate the masses on how to properly discipline. Making it illegal to do so, is what makes it problematic.

    haha, think of the rukus a little 5 year old would make if he found out this bill passed. He'd go ape, and so long as he had a phone near-by, his parent's couldn't touch him.
    Or he could just misbehave more in public when there are people around. The parents would naturally be more lax and lenient. Then when at home, more strict. It's inconsistency, and children need consistency and routine. They need to know the limits, they need to know what will happen as a consequence.

    This bill only causes more problems than it tries to ignorantly resolve.
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    Re: Spanking to be illegal...

    Quote Originally Posted by Apokalupsis View Post
    Or he could just misbehave more in public when there are people around. The parents would naturally be more lax and lenient. Then when at home, more strict. .
    How is that any different then what children do now?

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    Re: Spanking to be illegal...

    If parents are less strict now when out in public, it is poor parenting. It hasn't been demonstrated however, that this is the case (that kids are worse in public than in their own home).

    The difference will be, that the bill will encourage children to misbehave worse as the parents won't be able to use all the resources available to them (corporal punishment) for fear of going to jail and the child possibly going to the state (single mothers).
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  8. #8
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    Re: Spanking to be illegal...

    1. Spanking is most effective before children have developed verbal skills.
    2. Children under three have the least effective verbal skills.
    3. The law would prevent spanking of the only group of children where it is reasonable as a means of compensating for low verbal ability.

    * After three, spanking is almost never needed since it is possible to express to your child with words he/she will understand what he did wrong and what the consequences will be as a result.

    Try explaining to a 1 year old why he should not put his hand near the stove. A quick slap on the hand tells the child it is dangerous without him having to actually experience the pain of a hot stove. The proposed law would make such a hand slap illegal. Totally absurd!
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    Re: Spanking to be illegal...

    Couldn't be more true. Most of the spankings I've given my daughter (who is now 6) were when she was much younger. Although she's only been spanked about 5 times or so, we generally refrain from doing so now, but would if it were something major. Fortunately, I think we've disciplined her well and she is actually a very good little girl. Good manners, quite happy, never argues back... When she does get into trouble, it's a "Time-out step" for her. That usually does the trick.

    My 1.5 yr old son though, doesn't understand any more than a few dozen words. "Reasoning" with a 1.5 yr old is absurd, it can't be done. Not because children are stupid or just rebellious, but because the human MIND is incapable of such things.

    It isn't about explaining WHY something is wrong at such an early stage, it's about letting them know that it IS wrong. Long drawn out "Nooooo's" and hand pats and bottom pats work wonders for him. He's been swatted on his bottom once or twice for touching something dangerous (can't recall what). And it wasn't pain he experienced (couldn't w/ that diaper and such a soft swat)...it was the sudden reaction from his parents that got him upset. He can remember that it isn't good to do. And he doesn't, or he looks at us when he is thinking about doing something wrong, then he himself says "Nooooo" and leaves it alone.

    This assembly woman is just another radical lib out to control others. For some reason, certain groups of people think they are vastly superior and more intelligent than others, and it is their responsibility to command the others' lives.

    This same woman coincidentally, also had a very large recall push against her in the state of CA.
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  10. #10
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    Re: Spanking to be illegal...

    With all the problems in California. This is how some lawmakers are spending their time....ridiculus. I've spanked my children a few times and that's all it took for them to know the boundaries. Leave parenting to parents.
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  11. #11
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    Re: Spanking to be illegal...

    Apologies if this issue has been raised (... busy looking for theistic posts to argue against...).

    While I agree that legislatures have FAR better things to do I can envision one scenario in which I would support this bill.

    If and only if it were demonstrated that abusive parents are getting around the law by claiming they're "spanking" their children, then and only then would I support such an all-encompassing law. In this scenario, the law would be protecting children & not meant as a witch hunt against non-abusive pro-spanking parents.

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    Re: Spanking to be illegal...

    My problem with spanking is that many parents use it long after the efficacy evaporates. One of the many problems with this is that it causes kids to stay in the carrot-and-stick mentality as far as moral reasoning goes. It is the parents' responsibility to help their children progress to more mature moral reasoning, to internalize an impetus for correct behavior. The extended use of spanking usually achieves one of two outcomes in this context: either the children remain in the first levels of reasoning in which they believe that anything is ok as long as they can get away with it, or they progress in their thinking despite their parents and simply grow to resent them every time they are punished. Neither is good news for the parent.

    As far as actually enforcing a ban...well, I wish them the best of luck. I foresee a lot of frivolous court cases.
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    Re: Spanking to be illegal...

    Apok - The 'spanking' topic has been debated in the Brit Parliament a few times over the last decades. So far, while making it illegal most certainly has an enthuseastic following, it has not been passed into legislation.

    I for one feel that the current cruelty and assault laws are sufficient if applied rationally. A frappe is one thing, a full-blooded blow from an angry adult, albeit parent, is very much another. Parents should be warned loud and clear that children are not their 'property', and that they too have protection under the law from excessive and/or gratuitous violence.

    As Ibby well pointed out, NVC is the most effective way of getting a 'message' across prior to a child having comprehensive verbal skills.
    Additionally if used sparingly, it can be a useful 'reinforcer' as to the seriousness or non-acceptance of a situation.
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    Re: Spanking to be illegal...

    Quote Originally Posted by Zhavric View Post
    If and only if it were demonstrated that abusive parents are getting around the law by claiming they're "spanking" their children, then and only then would I support such an all-encompassing law.
    It's not "spanking" if the parents are abusive. I don't see how this case would have anything to do with a new spanking law.
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    Re: Spanking to be illegal...

    I agree.. beatings are already Illegal. By Def a spanking is not a beating. So what is the problem? The Calli Gov, can't tell the dif between a spanking and a beating?
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    Re: Spanking to be illegal...

    It is not the state's place to separate parents from their children for mild physical punishment. The definitions of abuse are well defined in most state statutes, and it would be preferable for the government to seek out those parents who severely beat or neglect their children. There remain too many headlines of children found imprisoned in small rooms for years.

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    Re: Spanking to be illegal...

    According to the article, at least 10 European countries ban spanking since 1979. Have any studies been done in those nations that correlate a rise in crime with anti-spanking laws?

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    Re: Spanking to be illegal...

    I can't believe I found a web site devoted to celebrity spanking stories - this is amazing
    : Celebrity Spanking Contributions A-H

    As far as the proposed law in California - it will be unenforcable except in a police state.

    Barbara Bush - The wife of the former President of the United States mentions in her book that as a child she was spanked with a hairbrush by her mother.

    Barbara mentions in her biography that she was spanked with a coat-hanger, and that her mother`s spankings were very hard.


    In Amy Fisher's autobiography, she talks about a spanking she received from her mother for hiding out at a friend's house when she was supposed to go home.
    I put on my galoshes and walked very fast to Tracy's house. When I get there I tell her: "I never want to go home again!" Tracy's closet is huge. She's even put a pillow in there for me. I'm excited. I'm at peace. I'm happy with my new life. Tracy will hide me in her room, bring me food, and everything will be good. Three hours later, my mother has figured it out. She isn't stupid, she knows I'm somewhere. She's called Tracy's mother and Tracy's mother has come into her bedroom and - well, there I am. Tracy's parent's drive me home. That was the only time - ever - that my mother hit me. As soon as I got home, she looked at me with a face lined by hours of worry on top of two years of daily stress, turned me over her knee, and slapped my butt till it was red. "Why did you do that? You had me worried out of my mind," yelled this woman who never raised her voice at me. All the frustration of the difficult juggling act that was her life at twenty-six came out in that spanking, that plea.


    Cindy Lauper - (contributed by Bruce) - In a radio interview Cindy Lauper told how her mother used to make her and her siblings bend over and spank them with a belt. She joked that the sound of the belt striking different bottoms was `Like a Xylophone.`

    Carley Simon - it was mentioned on the Howard Stern show that Carley was spanked by her mother. I also recall reading an article about Carly Simon, in which she confessed she got over her stage fright by getting spanked before every concert. I think she said the pain took her mind off how she was feeling. Whichever member of the crew was handy did the honors.
    Hillary Clinton - In the Book, Bill and Hillary, The Marriage, discusses on P.93 that Hillary could expect the reasonably frequent application of corporal punishment in the form of spanking from her Dad, Hugh Rodham.

    In a recent book dealing with the Clintons' marriage, it stated that Hillary's father was a spanker and she was on the receiving end at times. One occasion cited that when she got in trouble at school for talking she was spanked on her return home. (Confirmed)

    Janet Jackson - The American singer admitted on VH1 that she was spanked by her parents. The exact quote was this: Q: "Did your parents spank you? because there have been rumors circulating that they did." Janet: "Yes, they whipped us. It wasn't abuse, it was just a whipping when we needed it."
    Last edited by Snoop; January 20th, 2007 at 03:38 PM.
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    Re: Spanking to be illegal...

    I'll start by saying that I don't believe that it's spanking that should be illegal, it's assault. Slapping a child on the hand - just like slapping your friend on the hand - would not qualify as assault before any court imaginable. But characterizing any means of harsh spanking - spanking intended to inflict pain - for what it is does not seem like an unreasonable legal step to take. The current definition of spanking, I think, encompasses instances of assault, and it is the harmful spankings that I want to render illegal.

    Quote Originally Posted by Apokalupsis View Post
    I find this most absurd on so many levels I don't know where to begin. Note: This isn't an issue about whether what the most effective disciplinary action is, nor whether or not spanking is effective (studies have shown that it can be effective for some kids and if done in a proper way). It is about making spanking, a crime. It is about government telling us how to raise our children. It's saying that spanking, should be punishable as abuse, just like cutting off parts of a child's tongue should be. Most...absurd.
    Quote Originally Posted by Apok
    It's an extremist and radical position to have. Want to promote healthy discipline? Go for it, educate the masses on how to properly discipline. Making it illegal to do so, is what makes it problematic.
    Though a nice, purely utilitarian outlook, "I can hit someone because he/she is my offspring" doesn't cut it with me. Assault should be a crime (notwithstanding special circumstances, such as self-defense) regardless of the relationship between the victim and the committer. I don't see why spanking is any exception.

    Besides, as a question for legal spanking advocates: where do we draw the line at how much damage can be legally inflicted to a child by a parent? From what normally illegal acts, precisely, should parents be exempt, and on what grounds? So I can assault my child. What is excessive and what is simply my right as a parent? Where's the limit?

    Finally, the fact that the position may be radical or extremist - and I don't believe it is - doesn't have anything to do with its validity. An implicit appeal to popularity, created by characterizing positions as peripheral or radical, really has no place in a discussion of the policy's functionality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Apok
    It isn't about explaining WHY something is wrong at such an early stage, it's about letting them know that it IS wrong. Long drawn out "Nooooo's" and hand pats and bottom pats work wonders for him. He's been swatted on his bottom once or twice for touching something dangerous (can't recall what). And it wasn't pain he experienced (couldn't w/ that diaper and such a soft swat)...it was the sudden reaction from his parents that got him upset. He can remember that it isn't good to do. And he doesn't, or he looks at us when he is thinking about doing something wrong, then he himself says "Nooooo" and leaves it alone.
    Let me just say that within the context of spanking laws, you'd be the exception, not the rule. I have absolutely no problem with this type of parenting, and I certainly don't feel that it should be illegal. I think that sometimes "parenting rights" become a guise for legalized assault, however.

    Quote Originally Posted by Apok
    This assembly woman is just another radical lib out to control others. For some reason, certain groups of people think they are vastly superior and more intelligent than others, and it is their responsibility to command the others' lives.
    Yeah, those crazy controlling liberals! What right do they think they have to tell us whom we can or cannot assault? First they're trying to protect children, next they'll be trying to protect the elderly and disabled!
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    Re: Spanking to be illegal...

    Quote Originally Posted by starcreator View Post
    I'll start by saying that I don't believe that it's spanking that should be illegal, it's assault. Slapping a child on the hand - just like slapping your friend on the hand - would not qualify as assault before any court imaginable. But characterizing any means of harsh spanking - spanking intended to inflict pain - for what it is does not seem like an unreasonable legal step to take.
    Fine, so then redefine spanking, don't make it illegal. This Bill doesn't redefine, it includes all forms of corporal punishment (which includes my described spankings and even slaps on the hand).

    Though a nice, purely utilitarian outlook, "I can hit someone because he/she is my offspring" doesn't cut it with me. Assault should be a crime (notwithstanding special circumstances, such as self-defense) regardless of the relationship between the victim and the committer. I don't see why spanking is any exception.
    It isn't. I don't know what you are disagreeing with here though. You've already said that slapping a child on the hand is not assault, nor is how I spank.

    Besides, as a question for legal spanking advocates: where do we draw the line at how much damage can be legally inflicted to a child by a parent? From what normally illegal acts, precisely, should parents be exempt, and on what grounds? So I can assault my child. What is excessive and what is simply my right as a parent? Where's the limit?
    Well, it would seem that the onus is not on the pro-spanking group, but the anti-spanking group to draw the lines. The Bill says ANY spanking/slapping should be made illegal. The pro-spanking group would merely take the position that as long as it isn't assult or causes serious injury (requiring any medical care whatsoever), then it's fine. I think that is too much for a child in as far as punishment goes, but I don't see a sound argument against it.

    Finally, the fact that the position may be radical or extremist - and I don't believe it is - doesn't have anything to do with its validity. An implicit appeal to popularity, created by characterizing positions as peripheral or radical, really has no place in a discussion of the policy's functionality.
    You are right, the fact that it is radical or extremist doesn't say much in way of its validity, instead, the fact that it is asnine does.

    What is the argument to adopt the Bill, star? The Bill is too broad. It includes 100% of all corporal punishment, punishment that is proven to be quite effective (see post above).

    Let me just say that within the context of spanking laws, you'd be the exception, not the rule. I have absolutely no problem with this type of parenting, and I certainly don't feel that it should be illegal. I think that sometimes "parenting rights" become a guise for legalized assault, however.
    OK, so we agree that the Bill as it stands now, is absurd. It would seem like you wish to argue that there is a difference between spanking and assault (or at least, there should be). If so, I agree. Now we just have to figure out where to draw that line.

    Growing up in a very strict and physical childhood, I know how much it sux to be on the receiving end. But I'm unaware of any long-term effects that I or my siblings have suffered from gettin' beat. While some was probably over the line, none has any of us kids (we are all adults now) looking back, crying to a shreak, asking "Why? Oh why did I get beat?" Perhaps we are just tougher than others, perhaps it wasn't that big of a deal after all...who knows.

    What I do know, is that parents ought to at least educate themselves and care enough for their families to use proper, proven disciplinary actions instead of just do X because it was done to them. I also know that there is nothing wrong with corporal punishment. What is wrong, is to abuse your children. And corporal punishment in and of itself, is not abuse.

    And the analogy of spanking child vs spanking adult (like the assemplywoman tried to use) was as equally absurd as the bill itself. We don't spank or resort to physical action to those who can reason and/or we have no authority/responsibility over. It's comparing apples and oranges.

    Yeah, those crazy controlling liberals! What right do they think they have to tell us whom we can or cannot assault? First they're trying to protect children, next they'll be trying to protect the elderly and disabled!
    Wrong. They are speaking out of their asses, trying to force others to adhere to their own personal views despite lack of experience (she doesn't have any children for one, and she compared her cat "Snoop" to a child...she's a nutjob) and scientific research.

    The punishment for what I currently do to my children, can result in my child being taken away from me for up to a year. THAT does indeed harm children star. It isn't enough to have good intentions. One must apply reason as well. The liberals here in question, have been shown to lack any whatsoever.

    The below text has been automerged with this post.

    Quote Originally Posted by Snoop View Post
    I can't believe I found a web site devoted to celebrity spanking stories - this is amazing
    I can relate. I got spanked on the bear bottom with a hand, 2" wide leather belt, wooden cooking spoon, metal cooking spoon, ruler, paddle and a few other interesting gadgets I can't think of atm. I also got paddled at school (gradeschool)! You won't see that happening anywhere today.

    My brother outsmarted my parents every once and a while, and put toilet paper or thin books down his pants as a "spanking shield" (we didn't always get spanked w/ the britches down).

    Spanking and groundings were the only punishments we received. They were thought to be the end-all-be-all of punitive actions. We got a lot of them, they didn't seem to work, or we were just stubborn.

    The proper way to discipline IMO, is to use what works AND when the child is capable, explain why the disciplinary action is being given. There is no 1 magical pill of discipline. Parents need to learn how to adapt with the child's personality, aptitude, and stage in development. Parenting is a full-time job. Those wanting quick fixes, probably ought not to be parents. Those wanting to only use spanking or insist that it is the only form of punishment to be used, are wanting an easy way out IMO. Likewise, those IGNORING the fact and studies that show that spanking can be effective don't have the stones to do what is necessary.
    Last edited by Apokalupsis; January 22nd, 2007 at 11:29 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
    -=]Apokalupsis[=-
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