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Poll: Who is the worst terrrerosit?

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  1. #1
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    Bush is a terrorist

    If i had a choice to kill someone, i would first kill bush. He is a terrorist, worse than Bin Laden, and Sadam. After watching the movie farenheit 911, it has been proved that bush is a terreosit. Just wanted to see how many people agree with me.
    Live your present, 'cause past has gone and future may never come....

  2. #2
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    Re: Bush is a terrorist

    Quote Originally Posted by kalindi View Post
    If i had a choice to kill someone, i would first kill bush. He is a terrorist, worse than Bin Laden, and Sadam. After watching the movie farenheit 911, it has been proved that bush is a terreosit. Just wanted to see how many people agree with me.
    Okay I hate Bush probably 10 times more than you do, but you are not going to win any debates this way. I mean I could probably shread your arguments apart on just your form alone...so there is no way you should start a thread this way.

    What I suggest you do:

    Understand WHY you should hate Bush. I mean clearly Bush is a terrorist in that the federal government inherently uses fear of violence as their sole method for acquiring money. Taxation is nothing more than systematic, institutionalized terrorism on an absolutely enormous scale. So in that sense, Bush and the federal government has been committing acts of terrorism longer than probably anyone in the course of human history.

    Next, don't cite Michael Moore. He's an absolute moron and I disagree with him on principle. If Moore was to say that Oxygen is really great, I would stop breathing.

    Thirdly, learn the word libertarian and understand it. Read LewRockwell.com and Ludwig von Mises Institute Home. It is only libertarians (those who want the government to be minimized in both economic AND social liberties) who oppose ALL state wars, whether perpetrated by governments of Republicans or Democrats.

    Finally, learn how to argue syllogistically. Have a premise, like "theft is always wrong" and build from there.

    So here is how I would prove Bush is a terrorist:

    P1: The only reason why people pay taxes is out of fear of what would happen to them if they didn't pay taxes (otherwise the government would make taxation voluntarily.

    P2: The use of fear over voluntary means is what distinguishes a terrorist from a non-terrorist.

    P3: The US government uses violence if people don't pay their taxes.

    C1: The US government is a terrorist organization.
    "If you wish to know how libertarians regard the State and any of its acts, simply think of the State as a criminal band, and all of the libertarian attitudes will logically fall into place." -Murray Rothbard

    "There are a thousand hacking at the branches of evil to one who is striking at the root." -Henry David Thoreau

  3. #3
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    Re: Bush is a terrorist

    Quote Originally Posted by kalindi View Post
    If i had a choice to kill someone, i would first kill bush. He is a terrorist, worse than Bin Laden, and Sadam. After watching the movie farenheit 911, it has been proved that bush is a terreosit. Just wanted to see how many people agree with me.
    How does Farenheit 911 prove that Bush is a terrorist?
    But in your hearts revere Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect, keeping a clear conscience, so that those who speak maliciously against your good behavior in Christ may be ashamed of their slander.
    1 Peter 3:15-16

  4. #4
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    Re: Bush is a terrorist

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Hyde View Post
    How does Farenheit 911 prove that Bush is a terrorist?
    It doesn't.

    The only way to prove Bush is a terrorist is by accepting that government inherently uses violence and fear to exist.

    I understand that the term terrorist is being used loosely here, but I think that if you are defining terrorism as a method of achieveing things through violence and fear, then all governments are terroristical.

    Now maybe you think of a terrorist as being only an individual or a group less than 100 or whatever...it seems pretty arbitrary.

    But whatever you decide to call them, there is really no question that governments use terror to do thing.
    "If you wish to know how libertarians regard the State and any of its acts, simply think of the State as a criminal band, and all of the libertarian attitudes will logically fall into place." -Murray Rothbard

    "There are a thousand hacking at the branches of evil to one who is striking at the root." -Henry David Thoreau

  5. #5
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    Re: Bush is a terrorist

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Hyde View Post
    How does Farenheit 911 prove that Bush is a terrorist?
    Farrenheit 911 shows how bush is a terrorist organization.
    He killed Sadam hussain for no reason!
    Live your present, 'cause past has gone and future may never come....

  6. #6
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    Re: Bush is a terrorist

    Quote Originally Posted by kalindi View Post
    Farrenheit 911 shows how bush is a terrorist organization.
    He killed Sadam hussain for no reason!
    Bush isn't a terrorist organization because he isn't an organization.

    I know that Michael Moore's standards of the size of men may be a little unreasonable as we can't all be as huge as him...but clearly Bush is a single man.
    "If you wish to know how libertarians regard the State and any of its acts, simply think of the State as a criminal band, and all of the libertarian attitudes will logically fall into place." -Murray Rothbard

    "There are a thousand hacking at the branches of evil to one who is striking at the root." -Henry David Thoreau

  7. #7
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    Re: Bush is a terrorist

    Quote Originally Posted by kalindi
    He killed Sadam hussain for no reason!
    Er...much as I am against the Iraq War and all, Saddam Hussein was kinda an evil dictator type. Slaughtered thousands of his people and all that. Not a real nice guy. Definitely deserved to die.

    Gonzo, even if we accept your arguments, surely you would agree that intentionally slaughtering thousands of your own citizens is worse than taxation?
    Freedom is you choosing for yourself. Law is the government choosing for you. The two are opposites.

    Pray - To ask that the laws of the universe be annulled in behalf of a single petitioner confessedly unworthy - Ambrose Bierce
    Faith - Belief without evidence in what is told by one who speaks without knowledge about things without parallel - Ambrose Bierce

  8. #8
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    Re: Bush is a terrorist

    If Bush is a terrorist does that mean he is his own worst enemy?

    Saddam is dead and we don't know if Bin Laden is alive, that means Bush is the only one left in this poll who is definately alive (barely).
    While laughing at others stupidity, you may want to contemplate your own comedic talents. (link)
    Disclaimer: This information is being provided for informational, educational, and entertainment purposes only.

  9. #9
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    Re: Bush is a terrorist

    Quote Originally Posted by Castle View Post
    Gonzo, even if we accept your arguments, surely you would agree that intentionally slaughtering thousands of your own citizens is worse than taxation?
    Wait is Osama the one taxing? Because I thought sending your citizen soldiers to their deaths for a terrible war was tantamount to killing them?

    Anyway, I did not say that Bush was the biggest terrorist, but simply that he was one. I mean in terms of the amount of people he has used terror against, Bush is much worse than either of the two, except the US government is a chronic kind of terrorism, where as Osama was an acute instance.

    So I mean we could have a debate about who is the biggest terrorist, but so long as you recognize that the federal government are terrorists, then I'll consider it a personal victory.
    "If you wish to know how libertarians regard the State and any of its acts, simply think of the State as a criminal band, and all of the libertarian attitudes will logically fall into place." -Murray Rothbard

    "There are a thousand hacking at the branches of evil to one who is striking at the root." -Henry David Thoreau

  10. #10
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    Re: Bush is a terrorist

    I just don't know who is the worst terrrerosit . Spelling mistakes aside, what I find most difficult is discerning between Saddam and Osama in terms of who is worse. As far as GW is concerned, Bush was a terrible leader, but he wasn't a terrorist.

    Gonzo, the mere use of force, in any circumstance, doesn't make you a terrorist.
    [CENTER]-=] Starcreator [=-

  11. #11
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    Re: Bush is a terrorist

    Quote Originally Posted by starcreator View Post
    Gonzo, the mere use of force, in any circumstance, doesn't make you a terrorist.
    Oh, I totally agree. That's why I pointed out that he uses terror and fear to get his money. Read my little argument. The only way governments collect taxes is through the threat of violence (through peoples' fear), otherwise they would make taxes voluntary. So clearly no one can disagree that the US government (like all others that have ever existed) is a terrorist organization

    Although I understand the word terrorist has connotations of meaning a small group.

    So it's only a question of how you want to use the word...which is a semantic debate that I don't really want to have anything to do with.
    "If you wish to know how libertarians regard the State and any of its acts, simply think of the State as a criminal band, and all of the libertarian attitudes will logically fall into place." -Murray Rothbard

    "There are a thousand hacking at the branches of evil to one who is striking at the root." -Henry David Thoreau

  12. #12
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    Re: Bush is a terrorist

    Sorry to break the news....but F911 was thoroughly refuted by many people already. We even have a lot of it being shown to be pure rubbish here at ODN in our threads. The only ones who still believe the claims of 911, are those who willingly haven't taken the time to research the issues, and those who are incapable of doing so.

    A good start for those who ARE capable and willing: http://www.workingpsychology.com/dow...Fahrenheit.pdf

    As to the poll...of course Bin Laden is the worst terrorist. I don't see any reason to support this until the original claim that Bush is the "worst terrorist" is supported. It certainly isn't supported by F911...that was nothing but spoon-fed propaganda that only the uneducated (in as far as actual issues go) masses bought into.

    Moore is great for entertainment, but never as a source of truth. I dig him as an entertainer...for that is what he is...nothing more. But in no way is his work "serious" or factual.
    -=]Apokalupsis[=-
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  13. #13
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    Re: Bush is a terrorist

    F911 is a terrible movie as well as all of Michael Moore's stuff. I may dislike George Bush but actually Michael Moore is more a of terrorist than Bush in a number of ways. But, if I was to argue Moore is a terroorist then Rush Limbaugh is just as much of one too...then you have to bounce over to Al Sharpton...and then bounce back to Michael Savage...as said earlier, GW Bush is just a terrible leader.

    In the end, Bin Laden beats out Saddam for the title by just a horse length.


    _________________________________ Post Merged _________________________________


    Quote Originally Posted by Apokalupsis View Post
    Moore is great for entertainment, but never as a source of truth. I dig him as an entertainer...for that is what he is...nothing more. But in no way is his work "serious" or factual.

    This is even too much credit Apok...the sight of this guy just makes me sick, I can't watch him or listen too him at all.
    Last edited by cat's meow; February 27th, 2007 at 09:22 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
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    Love: A temporary insanity curable by marriage. ---Ambrose Bierce

  14. #14
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    Re: Bush is a terrorist

    Quote Originally Posted by kalindi View Post
    Farrenheit 911 shows how bush is a terrorist organization.
    He killed Sadam hussain for no reason!
    Firstly, it was the Iraqis (mainly a Shi'ite 'revenge thing'?) who topped Saddam.

    Secondly, Saddam was a tyrant to 'his own' country folks.

    Thirdly, Bush jnr did have his reasons to topple Saddam - although some of those reasons could be construed as highly questionable legally and morally, and 'his' actions not properly thoughout.

    Fourthly, all 9-11 does is 'prove' there were/are some seriously p*ssed off and scr*wed up Muslims afoot.

    ps. As for voting, I am keeping my powder dry and holding back on taking a shot at present.
    Last edited by FruitandNut; February 27th, 2007 at 10:14 PM.
    "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." - Anais Nin.
    Emitte lucem et veritatem - Send out light and truth.
    'Fere libenter homines id quod volunt credunt' - Julius Caesar (rough translation, 'Men will think what they want to think')
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  15. #15
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    Re: Bush is a terrorist

    Quote Originally Posted by Apokalupsis View Post
    Sorry to break the news....but F911 was thoroughly refuted by many people already. We even have a lot of it being shown to be pure rubbish here at ODN in our threads. The only ones who still believe the claims of 911, are those who willingly haven't taken the time to research the issues, and those who are incapable of doing so.

    A good start for those who ARE capable and willing: http://www.workingpsychology.com/dow...Fahrenheit.pdf

    As to the poll...of course Bin Laden is the worst terrorist. I don't see any reason to support this until the original claim that Bush is the "worst terrorist" is supported. It certainly isn't supported by F911...that was nothing but spoon-fed propaganda that only the uneducated (in as far as actual issues go) masses bought into.

    Moore is great for entertainment, but never as a source of truth. I dig him as an entertainer...for that is what he is...nothing more. But in no way is his work "serious" or factual.
    Most criticisms of F911 centre around its omissions (Wikipedia has an excellent summary of these criticisms). Only someone uninformed would suggest that his film - or any political documentary, for that matter - is flawless. But these flaws alone - though definitely relevant - are not enough to bring Moore down from "political activist" to "entertainer". Nitpicking at each section of Moore's documentary - though it definitely has its place in ensuring that viewers know the truth - isn't enough to make someone write off the entire documentary. He did document a great deal of his facts and sources in his accompanying reader, and his points still remain highly relevant in the modern era - especially considering that millions of former Bush supporters have now come around to Moore's position.

    I look forward to Moore's upcoming documentaries.

    Out of curiousity, Apok, considering Moore's position on the political spectrum, how is it that you consider repeated attacks upon your ideology "great for entertainment"? I don't find Ann Coulter's books, for instance, particularly entertaining.
    [CENTER]-=] Starcreator [=-

  16. #16
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    Re: Bush is a terrorist

    I don't hate Bush. Bush isn't a great president but I can live with it for one more year. Killing him would be a little short sighted on that note.

    Since Saddam is dead now, if osama is still alive I'd kill him first.

    I don't know whether osama or Sadaam was the worse terrorist. Both deserved to die.

    With my rifle propped and luv,
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    We do not see things as they are, we see things as we are.

  17. #17
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    Re: Bush is a terrorist

    Lol.. So much Anger in the world of today, so much killing.

    Anywaz, farenheit 911 is propaganda. I mean cmon, from wat i hear from u guys, it says bush is eviL. If thats not propaganda than wat is? Its all subjective. Do Your OWn REsearch And SEE yourselves,

  18. #18
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    Re: Bush is a terrorist

    It depends on how one defines terrorism. Mandates from people come into play as well. I'm fond of a saying that war is simply terrorism with a larger budget. The question, though, is Bu$h carrying out the will of the American people or is he some whack job acting on his own like Bin Laden? There's no question Bin Laden is, but does our ability to vote a president into office give him a mandate to (indirectly) perform acts of cruelty including murder?

    If you agree that Bu$h is carrying out the will of the people, then either Bin Laden is the bigger terrorist or we're all terrorists. If you believe Bu$h is acting on his own, then he's the bigger terrorist.

    As much as I dislike Bu$h, terrorist isn't the right label for him. War criminal, war profiteer, corrupt politician, dulusional neo-con whack-job and many others apply, but terrorist doesn't.

    Honestly, if any president was guilty of terrorism, it was Truman for dropping atomic bombs on civillian Japanese targets. Earlier presidents (such as Andrew Jackson) treatment of Native Americans also comes to mind.

  19. #19
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    Re: Bush is a terrorist

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Gonzo View Post
    Wait is Osama the one taxing? Because I thought sending your citizen soldiers to their deaths for a terrible war was tantamount to killing them?
    .
    They aren't citizen soldiers. They volunteered, have been trained extensively, and get paid. They are professional soldiers in any sense of the word.

  20. #20
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    Re: Bush is a terrorist

    Quote Originally Posted by kalindi View Post
    Farrenheit 911 shows how bush is a terrorist organization.
    He killed Sadam hussain for no reason!
    But how? HOW did it show it?
    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Gonzo View Post
    It doesn't.

    The only way to prove Bush is a terrorist is by accepting that government inherently uses violence and fear to exist.

    I understand that the term terrorist is being used loosely here, but I think that if you are defining terrorism as a method of achieveing things through violence and fear, then all governments are terroristical.

    Now maybe you think of a terrorist as being only an individual or a group less than 100 or whatever...it seems pretty arbitrary.

    But whatever you decide to call them, there is really no question that governments use terror to do thing.
    I can agree with that to an extent. I personally don't see a government as terroristic since its motive is generally the welfare of the people, which isn't common among terrerosit© groups who act solely in a self-serving manner.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Gonzo View Post
    Bush isn't a terrorist organization because he isn't an organization.

    I know that Michael Moore's standards of the size of men may be a little unreasonable as we can't all be as huge as him...but clearly Bush is a single man.
    QFT man...QFT.
    But in your hearts revere Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect, keeping a clear conscience, so that those who speak maliciously against your good behavior in Christ may be ashamed of their slander.
    1 Peter 3:15-16

 

 
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